How the hobby has changed!


Price difference between steam and diesel is the killer for me, especially when I came back to the hobby. At that time it was about 2-1 i.e. double a diesel for steam, now, for the steam that would interest me it's more like 3-1. So 2 or 3 diesels wins out for me. The only steam I would probably lash out on is the SP 4449, as it has been in excursion use across Montana at least twice. Don't know if it ever went on MRL's trackage or BNSF's northern route, but no matter, I'm not that prototypical. I've even considered painting the trucks on my MRL engines and rolling stock in a light gray, instead of the black they use, 'cause it looks so much better (example, someone else thinks so too)
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My guess is that the facebook group you allude to is pretty much people of like minds discussing what turns them on, not model railroading in general. I feel that the Transition Era is still the most popular. This is borne out by the books that Model Railroader has recently published: A Passion for Steam, Guide to Narrow Gauge Modeling, Modeling the transition Era, Piggyback and Container Traffic, Express Mail and Merchandise Service, 25 Freight Car Projects, Livestock and Meat Packing, Freight Cars of the 40s and 50s and Modeling the 50s. I would doubt that Kalmbach Publishing Company would tell their authors to go ahead and write books on subjects that they knew where no longer popular. My opinion (similar to your opinion) on the state of the hobby has no real backing other than my opinion given above and the fact that the last two Editors of the magazine have stated that it's their opinions the Transition is the most popular. In the end, it's what ever trips your trigger. I think many model railroaders like to build layouts showing railroading as it was when they grew up. I'm only 7 years older than you and remember seeing steam on the rails. To exclude steam from my layout would take out that part that holds the most interest for me.



Hawkesburytrain said:
The proof is with live interaction online and live in clubs. Sorry no statistic for you. You can join different Facebook groups which I've done (about 15-20 of them) and listen to what is being talked about or shown through pictures. This is just my opinion, but when I do see posts about steam era, it's mainly from people our age or older and clubs ran by older people. Today's era are posts from the younger generation with the latest diesel.

Sorry if I offended anyone by saying I was tired of steam. I've been subscribed to a few magazine in hoping to see ideas of the 70's era and I'd say that 60% of the articles are about steam. Most of the writers of these articles are our age. If they want to keep the hobby very alive, they would need to change their proportion.

OK Mark I got one stat for you, just to give you an idea of my Facebook feeds, 56 are diesel and 2 are steam. This was at 11:55PM tonight (15 minutes from my last check). The 2 steam are from older person and the 56 diesel are from people between 20 and 50 (ages are a guess as per their pictures). So going back to the original discussion, the hobby is changing and from what I see and hear, it's changing from steam to diesel. Also what I see and hear is that more and more younger people are joining the hobby (less than 60 years of age). That's why I say, it's not the hobby that is dying but more the steam era. In no way am I saying that steam will disappear, it will always exist, but less and less as older people pass away.

Tony, When I started in the hobby 3 years ago, I couldn't find CP steams for 2 years and I had people looking for me also. I finally will be getting my CP steam in 2018-2019 (Royal Hudson from Rapido).
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Mark does make a good point - farcebook groups, and the like, are made up of "like minded people" so using such groups to support an opinion is a little unrealistic. I'm sure there are groups on farcebook, and other places, equally committed to the steam/transition era as well. Using those groups as a means of supporting the steam argument would be just as unrealistic.

What I see is that the majority of people tend to "sit on the fence" and model the transition period, me being one of them; although, I don't refer to what I model as the transition era.

It would be interesting to ignore, as I think we should, what manufacturers, magazines and clubs claim and ask people here - those actually engaged in the hobby. A simple question - "What is the make up of your engines: Diesel, Steam, Combination of both". I think that might offer a good indication of whether the steam era is a forgotten one or not.

Whether you have a preference for steam or for diesel or for a combination of both - both should be available, as both are what make up the hobby as a whole.
 
Mark, Tony, I'm not talking about one Facebook group, I'm talking about 27 groups that I'm part of. NONE are specific to an era, they are all general groups such as HO scale, N scale, weathering, NMRA, etc. It's NOT about likes, it's about showing their layouts, their trains, buildings, but mostly about helping everybody. It's all about model railroading, techniques, electronics, etc..

I'm also part of a few Google groups, Blogs, live hangouts and other forums. YES i do spend a lot of time on research on the net such as how to's, ideas and discussions. That is why I can easily say what I've said.

I went on my first layout tour about a month ago, there was 4 layouts added to the tour, so the hobby is growing and out of the 12, there was only 1 steam.

In one of my live hangout group, there are 2 narrow gauge, 1 steam and 46 diesel people.

Mark, I'm modeling the 70's and it was decided very early that I would have a steam for excursions and like you, a steam needs to be part of a layout. Personally I grew up without trains as a kid and never been on a train until 3 years ago (except when I was 2, but I don't remember). Modeling steam would of been nice, but it would of demanded lots of research and questions and I would of been very restricted on my locomotives and freight (modeling CP).

Tony, I must disagree, yes people click like, but all those that post are sharing information that will help, I know it does for me. I will ask questions on something that is of interest. I posted on 3 groups (buildings, HO scale, NMRA) my pictures of the stair case, yes I had over 150 likes, but I also had over 12 questions of how's and what. For your info, there are very few steam groups. I did a search and found 3 and 2 of them asks their members if they should change their names, such as removing "era" and the other removing "steam". There are plenty of general group and all era's are present.

All era's will never die, but as years go by, the steam era is losing steam and in 30 years from now, the transition era will do the same and who know, in 60 years from now, the diesel era as we know it will do the same. Just look at all the electronics being introduce to the hobby, like JMRI, DCC++, Arduino, RasberryPI, etc. DC will keep existing as long as the older generation keeps it alive, but that era is also fading.

I think the younger generation are more involved on social media than forums. So if all we do is post in forums, we are missing out on some really nice stuff out there. One of the reasons I joined the social media for the hobby is that I can get answers much faster than in forums.

PS. Nothing against steam, if I'm to build a diorama one day, it will be N scale and steam.
 
Lloyd, All I can allude to is what I have seen and heard from so-called authorities on the hobby. Certainly they could be wrong. In the end it's he/she said, he/she said. Doesn't change my interests and it certainly shouldn't change yours! Good luck and best wishes! It is a fact, all things change over time, whether the change is good; or, bad, is in the eye of the beholder! I'm not a participant in social media, if I am missing out on the best information the hobby has to offer, so be it! I do this hobby for my own interests and fun! The truth is I probably miss-out on a lot of good videos and tips and I really don't care. I know what I want and am going after it!

Also, it's been my experience that although things may look one way at the local level, at the global level, things may look entirely different.
 
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So, we've been talking about the changes to the hobby, well things are changing and of this fact there can be no denying. We have DCC and sound decoders giving the ability to operate more than one train at a time with the locos able to make realistic sounds. Freight cars can be set up with sound decoders to produce cattle sounds and the "Clickity Clack of the RR track" and any other sound you feel should be added to your train. We have highly detailed freight and passenger cars that are ready to "plop" down on your layout and run, without assembly, if that is what you desire. If you your like me and still like to build kits, Accurail, Tichy, Bowser and a few others manufacturers still produce them; or, you can go to train shows; or, Ebay and find all the used-unbuilt kits you might desire. Kits for structures are still very popular.

I have to ask myself if all the new stuff and detailed "do dads" we have now, makes the hobby anymore exciting; or, fun. I suppose for many of you the answer might be a resounding "absolutely"! However, for me, I seem to be having the same amount of fun, I had back when I started. I believe that even if we went back to 1988, when I started this iteration of my involvement in the hobby, I would be having the same amount of fun with the hobby, as I am having with all the new changes. If you weren't involved back then, how could you possibly know how much fun those of us who where, had? So, change is inevitable in any endeavor you may consider. Is it necessary? Probably yes, from a manufacturers stand point. But, from my point of view, change can take place; but, isn't germane to my having fun with the hobby!
You have to consider for those of us in our 50s, 60s, 70s and 80s, change took place at a much slower rate! Things didn't go obsolete the day after you bought them and it sure felt to me that my money went much farther than it does today!
 
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Change is good!

Modern model railroading offerings are almost an embarrassment of riches! The quality, features, and amount of detail of recent-release H0- and N-scale locomotives have really ramped up! The new molds for my Fox Valley Models' N-scale GP60s look amazing! I also have a new Dynamis Ultima DCC system which enables touchscreen turnout-control, a graphical loco database, and complete PC integration, supporting automated train-control. This amazing system was only introduced in 2015, with its Rail Controller software roll-out I think in early 2016.

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Fox Valley Models' N-scale GP60 in SP colors.

Many of Kato's neat doo-dads are also recent entries: Kato's SoundBox in 2015, a new, US-style automated crossing for 2017, new concrete-tie Unitrack pieces, etc. In fact, it's Kato's cool little Portram LRV system and Unitram LRV track and road-plate sets which largely nudged me toward the decision to model in N-scale. Not to mention Kato's nice array of modern built-up Diotown structures.

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Kato N-scale Portram LRV on Kato Unitram track and roadplates.

Plus, with the advent of the internet and eBay, I'm able to populate my livery with out-of-production locos and rolling stock, many at the same prices they originally sold for or even less (yes, and some a bit more).

Also, innovative new products from Woodland Scenics and Scenic Express has made layout scenicking a breeze for even the most casual modeler (the days of bright-green Lichen are definitely over!). In fact I'm about to buy a pile of products, new for 2017, from Scenic Express thanks to their 20%-off Cyber Monday sale!
 
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I miss the wonderfull brass ads, PFM dominated the back cover for a couple decades nearly. Then there was the lists in the magazine of models I so longed to own as a kid/teenager. I am now slowly filling those desires. I am up to 7 brass models as I am very selective to what I buy as I run them, not collect. My layout, other than what the guy before me used, is all done old school style. MRC Cab Control model 2 runs the train. Older Atlas block selector switch panel cuts power to my side tracks so I can park one of my logging engines there. And as of today I finaly own one of the top models on my wish list, a PFM/United Sierra #38 2-6-6-2. Payment for painting a unpainted brass Schnabel car for a friend. Unfortunatly for the manufactures today, they make little I want or desire or am willing to pay for. For what a new BLI or Athearn Genesis diesel with sound costs, I can have another nice old brass model. Mike the Aspie
 
Chevron_GATX, Having lived through 67 years, I can't say that all "Change is Good". If you believe that it is, be sure to drink your Kool-Aid!
 
Evolution of anything IS inevitable, how we individually view that evolution that change is going to differ. Some opinions will be expressed as a result of "fond memories", others as a result of what we grew up with and were accustomed to, some will be determined by what we individually consider needed and others will be dependent on our skill levels and individual requirement.

Personally, I think the hobby has become far too technology focused with the advent of computerization and so forth. The hobby, to me, is a hands on thing, something you interact with rather than have some computer do everything for you.

On the other hand, the detail put into engines and rolling stock and even kits is a plus, a big plus and something that is appreciated. Advancements in scenery products meaning ground covers is also a plus and something that is beneficial and that adds a little more realism, not the least the introduction of things like static grass for example.

The introduction of DCC adds even more realism to a layout offering a person the opportunity of more interaction and hands on involvement.

Some will say the "good old days" were better, and (in may ways) I think they were generally speaking. In 50 years others will be regarding the here and now as "the good old days" and so it continue adinfinitum :)
 
Way to much thinking going on here! Oh, wait a minute, I guess this is a thinking man's hobby! Carry on!
 
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NP2626 said:
Chevron_GATX, Having lived through 67 years, I can't say that all "Change is Good". If you believe that it is, be sure to drink your Kool-Aid!
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Make mine grape-flavored, and I'll drink it with gusto. You have to admit, the quality of models, especially in N-scale, have greatly improved over the last decades.
 
malletman said:
I miss the wonderfull brass ads, PFM dominated the back cover for a couple decades nearly.
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That is an interesting observation. I can get into this camp. Not just the brass ads, but all the ads. Looking back I find I enjoyed reading the ads just as much and maybe more than the articles. There are only so many "how to weather a box car" articles before the techniques are covered. But the ads, always spurred the "what if" imaginations and dreams of layouts future.
 
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