TrainController questions

[fcwilt]

There is not much point in making a reversing section much longer then your longest train as under normal circumstances only one train can be in the reversing section at one time.

So if the top loop is 10' total I would divide that into 2 or 3 blocks, only one of which would be the reversing section and would be long enough to hold your longest train. Regular blocks can be shorter.

I would do something similar to the bottom reverse loop, making it no longer the needed for your longest train.


Rather then use Tower Controllers and BOD-8s you can use the newer WatchMan. It basically works the same but the system no longer uses a central control (the Tower Controller) with "satellite" boards. Instead each type of board (detection, turnout control, etc) is a dedicated purpose board. All of the boards communicate with one another and TC (Train Controller) using a simple 3 wire bus.

Notice that a BOD-8 can be used WITH a WatchMan to extend the WatchMan from 8 blocks worth of detection to 16 blocks. You could of course use two WatchMan to get 16 blocks.


To connect the Tower Controllers to TC you use a LocoBuffer-USB device.

To connect the newer system to TC you use a LocoBuffer-USB device and a SSB-Gateway device.

If you want to use an existing LocoNet and connect the newer system devices to it you can use just an SSB-Adapter device.

I prefer to have my control/detection system use a separate connection to TC so I would use the LocoBuffer-USB/SSB-Gateway approach.


Attached is a diagram showing the basic wiring for the WatchMan.

 

[rzw0wr]

If I understand correctly I will need the following from RR-CitKits:
LB-USB
SSB-Gateway
WatchMan 1 for each 8 blocks.
1 Coil for each block.

 

[fcwilt]

If I understand correctly I will need the following from RR-CitKits:
LB-USB
SSB-Gateway
WatchMan 1 for each 8 blocks.
1 Coil for each block.

That is correct.

The coils are available in sets of 8.

You will also likely want to purchase some of the plastic mounting "track" which makes it simple to mount the WatchMan boards (and any others RR-CirKits boards). You can purchase pre-cut sections from RR-CirKits which is the simplest given that you will likely only need 3-4 WatchMan.

Are you going to provide detection for your yards?


You also might want to provide occupancy detection for your turnouts or groups of turnouts. TC can use this occupancy information to prevent turnouts from being thrown under cars, to improve train tracking, etc. Not everyone sees the need for this but to me it is worth doing.

A quick look at your plan suggests that, for the main line, you would need 5 more occupancy detectors:

#1 for T2
#2 for T5, T6
#3 for T9, T10, T11
#4 for T4, T7, T8
#5 for T1, T3

 

[rzw0wr]

Thank you fcwilt.
No detection for the yard yet.
I would like to later when I get my industries put in.

How do you assign a detector to a turnout?
I can't make a turnout a block.

Do I need to get some Cat5 cable?

 

[fcwilt]

Thank you fcwilt.
No detection for the yard yet.
I would like to later when I get my industries put in.

How do you assign a detector to a turnout?

Drat. I keep forgetting to test with the correct color of TC. Occupancy detection for turnouts is only available in Gold.

In Silver you have to assign the occupancy indicators to the Routes.

Assigning occupancy indicators to Turnouts is a "short-cut", so to speak, in that the occupancy indicator for the Turnout is applied to any Routes that the Turnout is part of.

So in Silver you would have a RR-CirKits occupancy detector wired to a turnout or group of related turnouts and then assign the corresponding TC occupancy indicator to all Routes which included that turnout or any of the turnouts in the group.

The result is basically the same, just more work to do setting in up in TC.


To clarify, when I say "group of turnouts" I mean two or more turnouts which appear on the TC switchboard diagram and there are no TC blocks between them.

I have modified the original block diagram to add a new block, Block 18, between T3 and T4.

I think you can now easily see the turnout groups that would all be electrically connected and share one RR-CirKits occupancy detector.

If this is not clear please let me know.

 

[rzw0wr]

I have TC Bronze.

I will need to think about all the stuff you said.
I am a slow thinker and getting worse every year.

 

[fcwilt]

I have TC Bronze.

I will need to think about all the stuff you said.
I am a slow thinker and getting worse every year.

Didn't you say your wife said you should get Silver?

I fully relate to slow thinking - getting older is just SO much fun.

Perhaps if I typed slower?

 

[rzw0wr]

HAHAHAHAHA. That would work. Then I can read slower.

Yes the missus told me to get it but I didn't yet.
I want to better understand Bronze first.

 

[fcwilt]

I want to better understand Bronze first.

Understood.

However Bronze is really limited in so many ways.

And seems to me if you have any chance of getting Herr Freiwald to allow you to upgrade without penalty you need to try ASAP.

While you won't lose any work if you do start with Bronze you are going to learn a few things that you will have to "unlearn", so to speak.


I typed real slow that time - did it help?

 

[rzw0wr]

Yes it did help a lot. Thank you.

The missus said I could buy the Silver package however, she didn't tell me from where the money was to come.
If I had the extra cash I would buy it.

It is going to pretty well break my train budget for awhile to get the detection hardware.

 

[fcwilt]

Yes it did help a lot. Thank you.

The missus said I could buy the Silver package however, she didn't tell me from where the money was to come.
If I had the extra cash I would buy it.

It is going to pretty well break my train budget for awhile to get the detection hardware.

Ah... I was thinking that she somehow made it into a Xmas present for you.

Regards the RR-CirKits stuff: You might want to check with Wombat457. I sent him some leftover RR-CirKits stuff I had but I don't think he ever used it. Perhaps, if he is not going to use it, he would part with it. Doesn't hurt to ask I suppose.

 

[rzw0wr]

Thanks fcwilt.
I will drop him a PM.

 

[rzw0wr]

My "stick" came today.
I am waiting for the e-mail to tell me the rest of the story.

fcwilt, I am planning to order RR-CirKits today.

1 - LB-USB
3 - Watchman
3 - packages of coils (24)
1 - SSB-Gateway
3 - 3TK2-1 trays

How about Cat5 cable?
Any other wires or cables?

ANY thing else I need to order.
Their ordering system sucks and I only want to do this once.

Get ready for some heavy duty help here.
I am sure I will have a million questions.

Maybe I can hire you to hook this all up.
I will give you room and board and all the coffee you can handle.
The room is good the food is nasty.

 

[fcwilt]

Hi Dale,

Yes the web site is not so good - fortunately their products are.

Call them - Karen and Dick, if memory serves me. They are very nice folks.

If you tell them I sent you they will probably charge you extra.


For wiring the coils I use CAT5e but you could also use CAT6 - somewhat more expensive.

I cut a length of cable long enough to reach the most distant coil, strip off the outer covering and separate the four sets of twisted pairs. There is a string inside the cover that you can pull down the length of the cable. It should slice the cover open without much trouble.

Then for each coil I do this:

- Untwist the ends of a pair, 2"-3"
- Strip the ends, about 1"
- Slide a 1" length of 3/32" heat shrink on each wire
- Wrap the bare ends of the pair around the leads of the coil, one wire per lead
- Solder the wires to the leads of the coils - keep the heat shrink away from the heat of the soldering iron
- Slide the heat shrink over the leads of the coil and shrink
- Re-twist the pair

Since I did that at the work bench I did all of the coils at one time.


For the Simple Serial Bus (SSB) you could purchase some 3 conductor wire of the appropriate gauge. You might find something at HomeDepot/Lowes. Ask the folks at RR-CirKits what they use.

But I tend to use my CATx cable whenever I can.

If you purchased CAT6 for you coils, each wire is going to be 22-24 gauge. If you used one pair for EACH SSB connection you would end up with the equivalent of a 19-21 gauge wire. When you combine two wires of a given gauge X the result is a wire of gauge X-3.

So a length of CAT6 cable would provide the 3 wires (3 pairs) needed for the SSB with one pair unused.

 

[rzw0wr]

Thanks fcwilt.
I copied the above to Word to printout later.

I just ordered all the stuff for RR-CirKits by email.

Will they send an e-mail back confirming the cost?

 

[fcwilt]

Thanks fcwilt.
I copied the above to Word to printout later.

I just ordered all the stuff for RR-CirKits by email.

Will they send an e-mail back confirming the cost?

I would think they would but I always order by phone so I don't know for sure.

 

[rzw0wr]

Karen sent me an e-mail today.
It had the invoice attached.
Sent them payment through Paypal.
She said she would mail it Monday.
I should have it later this week.

These are kits that need to be assembled correct?

BTW, when TC shuts or you close it how do you get your track to turn on again.
I have to reboot mine.
The throttle will not power it up until I do.

 

[fcwilt]

Karen sent me an e-mail today.
It had the invoice attached.
Sent them payment through Paypal.
She said she would mail it Monday.
I should have it later this week.

That is good news.

These are kits that need to be assembled correct?

No, fully assembled and tested. You will need to configure the boards to different addresses. I haven't used a WatchMan but I'm sure the process will be in the documentation.

BTW, when TC shuts or you close it how do you get your track to turn on again.
I have to reboot mine.
The throttle will not power it up until I do.

I don't have that problem. There are TC toolbar buttons for turning track power on and off. Have you tried them?

 

[rzw0wr]

Yep, the icons in TC work fine.
The track will not come on after TC as turned of until I cut the power to the track and restart.
I also have to press the first 2 buttons on my PR3 all the time.

 

[fcwilt]

Yep, the icons in TC work fine.
The track will not come on after TC as turned of until I cut the power to the track and restart.
I also have to press the first 2 buttons on my PR3 all the time.

When you get the LocoBuffer try that in place of your PR3.

I use a LocoBuffer with my Digitrax DCS-100 and DCS-200 and do not have any problem with the layout returning to the state it was when I shut TC down.