Are these the same but in diffrent packaging? they look simmilar
Yes, no, maybe.
Rivarossi made in Italy was imported by a company called AHM in the 1960s and 70s. AHM went out of business. The same guy came back to life as IHC at some point, and I'd say between 1980 and 1995, Rivarossi stuff showed up in IHC boxes, plain red Rivarossi boxes, and even ConCor label. At some point in the early 90s, there was a huge run of Rivarossi cars in the red IHC boxes. Basically from the Rivarossi molds, with a wild assortment of paint schemes, everything other the sun, dirt cheap.
About 1995, Rivarossi seemed to completely split from IHC. Rivarossi was imported under its own name by a company called Model Expo. Expo eventually went under. Then Walthers got involved, and the first new Rivarossi label tooling in decades happened circa 2003 - a set of four shorty heavyweights, a UP ACF coach, a UP dome lounge obs, and retooled improvements of the UP dome coach and diner. These cars are often referred to as "Waltherossi" cars - they are recognizably Rivarossi but have Walthers style trucks and coupler mounts.
Then this deal fell apart, and Rivarossi apparently went out of business before being acquired by Hornby, and their stuff is once again beginning to appear.
In the mean time around 1999 IHC introduced a bunch of new tooling passenger cars. At first glance they appear to be the Rivarossi cars, but they are not. The Rivarossi cars are state of the art for about 1970; the IHC cars are of similar construction but they really are a mess in terms of prototype and even basic things like body shape. The 8 fluted streamline cars all have prototypes - 5 are Southern, 3 are Santa Fe. They are just poorly executed with generic underframes, the generic lifeless Rivarossi-copy trucks, and for some reason - although all represent Pullman Standard prototypes, they all have Budd ends, obviously copied from Rivarossi's four Budd cars done in the late 1980s. The roof contour is wrong on all of them. IHC then came out with the same 8 cars in smooth side versions, which are 100% bogus. Some of them are reasonable looking and close to existing prototypes, but basically they are just the fluted cars without the fluting.
Lastly, IHC released a group of heavyweight cars which are just bloody awful. The windows don't even match from one car to the next - they are caricatures at best. If you're looking for a passenger train in a certain paint scheme, and don't care if the individual cars represent the railroad, the IHC cars are cheap and will look ok if you don't put them next to anything better... like even a Rivarossi. Definitely don't put them next to a Walthers car! Except for the IHC heavyweights... they are just abominations and I can't in good conscience recommend them for anything.
As to how to tell what you have... if it came in a Rivarossi box, or says Rivarossi on it anywhere - in a Walthers, Expo, Riv, AHM, or IHC box - then it's Rivarossi. If it came in an IHC box and doesn't say Rivarossi on it anywhere, it's probably one of the new IHC cars. If you're not sure, post a picture of the car - I can tell you what it is if I can see it.
Andy
