Steve Jobs' innovation needed in model railroading !


N

new2nscale

Member
With the recent passing of computer (among other tech devices) pioneer Steve Jobs, I got to thinking how the model railtroading community, and the hobby in general, could benefit from abstract innovators like him in OUR hobby. The possibilities are endless, from bulletproof uncoupling (right down to Z scale), life-like human figures that walk, to the "I cant believe it hasn't happened yet in the smaller scales" feature that no track transmits power, ever. There are endless possibilities of greater realism and easier operating for all age levels, but methinks we lack the radical innovators ! I would love to know what Model R/R Forums users have as a wishlist, what THEY would like to see happen in the model railroad sphere, as far as greater realism, less labourious tasks (ballasting track inch by inch comes to mind), and just more enjoyment in the hobby. For starters, mine is a "drop in and basically go" system for HO and N that operates working crossing gates & flashing lights without all the electronic gizmos needed, or adjustments. C'mon, if 5,000 songs can be loaded onto a tiny piece of plastic, stored, and listened to in any order, WITHOUT any moving parts, why the heck is MY [relatively simple] model r/r wish still waiting ??
If anyone can channel Steve Jobs ' mind from the other side, get on it !!!!
 
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Animation is always desired on a layout as it seems for most that 'the world' stands still while the trains move however, ballasting track, putting components together such as a grade crossing and associated electronics to make it all work automatically as the train passes is all part of the hobby.

Part of the satisfaction of this hobby when a friend comes round and admires your work is to stand back and say "I did that!". Do we really want ready to run railroads straight from a box?? In my opinion, I would say not...
 
^ The best part any layout is the fact that it's never finished! :D

I think that DCC is the best innovation the hobby has had and quite possibly will ever have. Not having to rely on tracks for power would be great, but it's just not really feasible in the smaller scales due to size constraints for batteries. A better idea would be to make the capacitors that some people install into trains a standard feature.
 
I think lighting and sound effects are an area that we could see vast improvements and large price drops. The key would be to use parts that have broader application than our little hobby niche. Charged screens for building window that can lighten and darken? Surround sound effects triggered by trains passing our other events? All doable, maybe standard on your Woodland Scenic ready built buildings. Just a thought.

Unlike Apple though I hope there becomes standards, but not locked down controlled propriety systems.
 
Steve doubtlessly had an impact on todays electronics. with that using him as synonym for innovation is just not right as there are certainly more deserving names for this title. regardless, hobby draws its target population. those not inclined to participate in hobbies will not be looking in MRR way regardless of innovations - i do not see a groundbreaking product that will suddenly make MRR more attractive for broader audience. hence this market will not be of such attraction to all kinds of different Steves Jobs out there.

Gary B said:
Surround sound effects triggered by trains passing our other events?
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already there. built into JMRI as i understand to some degree,
 
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Great responses ! I think I'll get working on developing my first "walking human" in HO to start. I envision the primary efforts to resemble a Nazi "goose-step" sort of walk, but hopefully a realistic gait can be achieved. Check back with me in 8-10 years, maybe longer ! And btw, I never meant "easier" in terms of what wild innovation would achieve, rather increased realism. "Fun" for me is not trying to set up a realistc flasher, operating crossing gates and/or wig-wag signal in N scale. That's punishment !!!
 
new2nscale said:
"Fun" for me is not trying to set up a realistic flasher, operating crossing gates and/or wig-wag signal in N scale. That's punishment !!!
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Why??

Drilling some holes & stringing a few components together is punishment, yet inventing a walking HO figure is not??

I think you'll find a hell of a lot more frustration in the latter...
 
never thought...

I didn't think the question in my posting would create any kind of arguement, but I guess some look for that kind of thing.....
I know many modellers who HAVE become frustrated at toying with crossing gates that lower properly, sensors that work in low light, etc, and just think the hobby would benefit from a stress-free and reliable system. Currently its certainly not as simple as you suggest, at least not realistically. I'm also certain that if a Silicon Valley co. put their mind to it, we'd see one in less than a years' time.
Rather than contesting everything I say, why dont you put forth YOUR wishlist, or do you think the hobby is perfect ? Oh, and my tongue was firmly in cheek when I said I was to begin developing walking model humans...THAT'S where I think someone with Jobs' vision is needed in our hobby.
Now, onto something easier, how do you feel about the protesters occupation of Wall St. ????
 
lol.. I must appologise new2nscale if I offended you..

I certainly wasn't arguing with you in any way, and I apologise if my bluntness came accross that way, I was just simply challenging your train of thought, nothing more.. And I was under the impression that this thread was started for debate, no!?!

Many modellers are/become frustrated generally because they lack a particular skill set, be it planning - woodwork - electrics - scenery, I guess I do tend to forget that I am lucky as I grew up in a model railway (railroad) club so I learnt all of those skill sets at a very young age. Most peoples fears/frustrations when it comes to model railroading comes from the unknown and the fear of getting it wrong, rather than just having a go until they get it right, or of course asking, which the male species doesn't really like to do if they don't have too lol..

Yes I'm sure that people would like a stress free and reliable system, but life isn't like that, there are too many variables in this hobby, especially the weather being one..

If my memory serves me correctly, Woodland Scenics sell a module system which is near enough a ready to run layout, but at an astronomical cost (at least here in the UK).. The main enjoyment of this great hobby of ours is the satisfaction of doing things yourself, or else if you have the money, you just go to a professional model maker and have a custom layout built for you..

To answer your question, yes I do think this hobby is perfect! Well almost.. The fact of the matter is that it's a hobby.. Something to while away the hours of downtime whilst 'Er indoors' watches the soaps.. My only wish is that DCC components, especially DCC sound was made more affordable, but apart from that I can live with everything else..

Walking humans in HO scale is not beyond the realms of possibly, maybe on sunken wires or with magnetic bottoms similar to how some made road vehicles move on a layout before the Faller road system..

As far as the protesters on Wall St go, I don't really know much about it in all honesty, but from what I do know, I just hope you don't end up with riots like we did over here earlier in the year... ;)
 
something to agree on...

From the UK ?? Well here is something terribly off-topic I'm sure we'll agree on:

MUSIC from the UK !! Unparalled, to put it mildly. I grew up with Zeppelin, Pink Floyd, the Stones, the Who, Queen, ELO, Fleetwood Mac, Deep Purple, Genesis, Yes, the Moody Blues.... I could go on and on. Oh, and Elton John, Peter Frampton, McCartney & Wings, Dire Straits.....ALL of these products of England ! There is NOTHING, repeat NOTHING, coming out of anywhere today that even comes close to resembling in any way, shape or form, the pure sonic pleasure(s) of those groups' music. I still listen to all that stuff while modelling. Anyone who had ears that worked from say 1965-1982 knows what I'm talking about. What coming out now (or even the last 15 years) equals those amazing artists ???
 
Walking figures? Really?

I know of people who stress out programming one DCC decoder...and that's just for a locomotive. You'd need a lot more people than locomotives on a layout...I can't picture full size people having to program the miniature people.

The hobby has gotten to the point that there are those who open a box and put the model on the layout, and they're proud of their accomplishment. Curse all those companies that make them put the ladders on a boxcar!

I'm all for innovation, but I think we have to have certain realistic limits. Yes, we could use nanotechnology to create moving figures on a layout, but isn't that a waste of resources? That same nanotechnology could be used in medicine, which is far more important than our hobby....

Just my two cents.

Timothy Dineen
 
Steve Jobs history

If we now think a tool maker building a die for an engine body is expensive, try to consider the engineering costs to develop drop in animation. Apple only has 5% to 10% of the computer market and their prices show that. I tend to see our hobby as just that, a hobby. I built a tiny 3 1/2" x 9" HO module of a log cabin with hand cut shingles, a one hole outhouse, well, and a wood pile with chopping block and ax. It cost me about $1.40 and gave me 20 to 30 hours of happiness. If anyone is willing to pay me $10/hour with no benefits I will build you one also.

I am now retired and have MY Big Boy 4005 and Pioneer Zephyr 9900, somewhere around $800.00. If you needed 3 crossing gates how much would you be willing to pay for each. Years ago Ambroid (sic) made 1 of 5000 kits. Could you line up 5,000 customers for this animation? You would have to make it worth someones efforts to develop and produce such a product. And don'[t forget about the Pre-Order system.

I will end with a story, just a story about Thomas Edison I believe. A generating plant had a problem and asked Edison to fix it. He stayed with the machinery throughout the night, listening for the problem. The next day the owner came in and asked if the problem was solved. Edison replied 'yes' and took a piece of chalk, drew an 'X' on the machine and said 'drill a 1" hole here." The owner was happy and asked how much he owed Edison who replied '$25,100'. The owner was furious and asked 'Why so much? You were only here for a few hours!' Edison replied, '$100 for my time, $25,000 for knowing where to put the X.'

Steve Jobs knew where to put the X.

Armchair armchairmodeling.blogspot.com
 
I honestly do not see Steve Jobs as that great of a person. Apple as a company was only successful because of its marketing abilities. There were other MP3 players before the Ipod even came out and they were less expensive, yet younge people were told that you needed the Ipod.

A better example of innovation would be Linux and the distros of operating systems that came about from it, and how something free is ran on 8 of the top 10 supercomputers in the world, and how it runs at least 50% of the world's servers if not more.

As for those speaking about the track having no power. I would hate buy trains that have batteries in them. I like the track having power, less waste and less expense. Batteries are expensive and kill the environment.

As for model railroading. Here are the innovations that will come about in 10 to 20 years from now:
1. Wireless power. Yes the trains will run on wireless power so wiring will become a lot easier.
2. Hands free train operation. You will be able to control the trains by putting a head band on, that reads your brain and lets you control all the trains with just your mind.
3. Self balancing train engines, that let you have just a single track and the train balances on it. With gyros and stuff. (Monorail)
4. The hobby will reduce in size, as digital train layouts will take over from physical ones. Following the generation trends, most younger people do not enjoy physical activities. The model train will move onto the computer, and as the internet has done to many things right now, it will destroy the hobby.
 
anyone ??

Anyone predict a return to the "Troller" power packs ?? Remember those, with the Halloween black & orange colors ?? The many replies are fun to read. As for the hobby and new advances stealing away anything from medical advances, that is my LAST desire. If it comes down to curing cancer or AIDS, vs. z scale Tehachapi Loop in a box ready-to-go, we'll cure those diseases first. Something that would make ME thrilled, and I'm sure somewhere this is done, not requiring wild technological advances, is actual RUNNING water in rivers and streams on a layout....God, when I win the lottery it will be S or O (G ?) scale trains, realistic (though not life-size) mountains, and real water that moves throughout the layout, complete with sound emulating the swish of a fast-moving river.....I guess there's an electrical shock hazard in there somewhere, but we'll work on that ! Keep the idea's (and fantasy's) coming !!!
 
sd50f said:
I'm all for innovation, but I think we have to have certain realistic limits. Yes, we could use nanotechnology to create moving figures on a layout, but isn't that a waste of resources? That same nanotechnology could be used in medicine, which is far more important than our hobby....
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Timothy, I really don't understand this statement. Technology is used for all sorts of things in life, take for example the simple microchip, it is used to help regulate my medication without which I wouldn't be able to live a 'normal' life (& I use the term normal in the loosest of sense lol) and yet it is also used in my loco decoders in order that my hobby is made more enjoyable.. So I really don't see how you think that using nanotechnology in a hobby (which we already do by the way) would take anything away from the medical community?? Or any other for that matter...


Nucular said:
1. Wireless power. Yes the trains will run on wireless power so wiring will become a lot easier.
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Now this did make me chuckle..
Hate to be pedantic here (but I will be anyway lol) if the power is wireless, then what wiring?? lol...
 
Disclaimer: This is my opinion and may not be yours.

I don't see computer simulations taking any thing away from the physical model railroading. Two entirely different things. This was said about video games from the beginning.
The people I know that are in to train simulation are either into both or only one. I feel that doing the computer thing may actually get some one to move into the realm of actual physical models that you you can touch and see move in 3D. The 2D thing has a lot of limits as far as reality goes.
One is into touching and building things or not.
 
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