Grrrr. My new Bachmann Locomotives


T

TomR

Member
I just received three new Bachmann Locos and some cars.

My EMD GP7 62401 ran fine backwards and forward across all tracks. One of the cars and my A unit 61802 RF16 would derail everywhere.

I worked hours on my tracks, and even changed out some sections and one turnout, but the problems just seemed to move around. I can run backward pushing and forward pulling at full throttle through the same points with other locos and not have problems.

I measured the wheel back spacing on the problem car and it was .075 inch or so too close (according to NMRA) on two axles. I could spread the wheels so that fixed it.

I flipped the Baldwin over and by pushing down slightly on the wheels two of the axles would lock and "snap" instead of smoothly sliding. They would not smoothly slide side-to-side with any pressure at all that would simulate the weight each axle might have.

I forced the axles back and forth a few dozen times and the snapping got less. Now, after working the wheels side-to-side a few dozen times, the A unit almost never derails!!

What the heck is this all about?? Should I trust this new Bachmann Chinese engine?? I spent hours working on track just to find out it was probably caused by whatever makes two of the axles not have free side play when under any pressure. What this would do is throw the wheels off the track anytime there was a slight dip or side wiggle. This included the slight change going through frogs, or where a track would change curve directions.

Did they leave a burr on something inside..... like on an axle?? Or is this a design flaw that will come back to haunt me later??

Tom
 
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#1, almost all the locos now are coming out of the same factories, regardless of brand. They aren't neccessarily the same design, but they are coming out of the same factory, so quality control should be comparable. From the sounds of it, there are some burrs or flash on the gears that is binding things. If these are new, I'd run them in for a few hours before getting too excited.....your forcing the axles back and forth was a forced version of a normal break in.
 
You need to get a wheel and track gauge and make sure all wheels are OK. Also each wheel has a wiper riding on the back to pick up current. They can be adjusted to put even pressure on each wheel but you will have to remove the bottom truck cover and wheels to do this. The covers just snap on and off and you can adjust the wheels and wipers. Happens on alot of engines not just Bachmann.

Bob
 
bobwrgt said:
You need to get a wheel and track gauge and make sure all wheels are OK. Also each wheel has a wiper riding on the back to pick up current. They can be adjusted to put even pressure on each wheel but you will have to remove the bottom truck cover and wheels to do this. The covers just snap on and off and you can adjust the wheels and wipers. Happens on alot of engines not just Bachmann.

Bob
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For the price of the engine, why shouldn't Bachmann check it and fix it under warranty? Or does everyone just do it themselves??
 
1. It's usually faster and easier to do it yourself. It will also be a learning experience
2. Bachmann will fix it if you send it back, expect to wait 6 weeks.
3. Bachmann usually is too busy to fix it so they'll most likely send you a new one, may or may not be the same road number. (yes, after 6 weeks)
4. Almost all of the stuff in the hobby comes from the same factory called Sanda Kan which is now a subsidiary of Kader, Bachmann's parent company. They also manufacture items for companies like Atlas.
5. Quality control has gone into the toilet since the labor "revolution" in China. I've had bad Atlas locos from the more recent runs.
6. This one is my opinion, but if you buy Bachmann, you're asking for trouble. (I've had and fixed Bachmann engines before and sold all but one. I've had problems with all of them, the quality control is nonexistant)
 
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I'll second what Eric said......and repeat what I said, "run it for a few hours and see if it breaks in" . If it does, problem solved. If it doesn't, you can still send it in. But as Eric said, expect a lengthy wait. And if you assume Bachmann has some sort of check they do before shipping, your engine apparently passed, so they may check it ,pass it (again), and send it back unchanged. Or they may scratch their heads and simply send you a new engine , which might be better and might be worse.
Out of the box RTR is becoming harder and harder to find......over half the cars I buy have parts laying in the box.......most engines have at least one axle out of gauge. If you send every problem back, you'll have more stuff back at the factory than you do on the layout. So I'll second Eric about the learning experience......it's becoming a neccesity to do simple repairs yourself, and there's definitely a satisfaction from "doing it yourself".
Older Bachmanns were definitely hit or miss, but the new ones are equal to the other brands coming out of the Sanda Kan factory........and Bachmann has the only lifetime warranty.
 
I think the newer stuff may not have the lifetime warranty. Also, the warranty is conditional meaning that you need to keep the receipts or else you'll have to beg them to fix it for free.

The newer stuff isn't much better IMHO.
 
MRLdave said:
and Bachmann has the only lifetime warranty.
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Bachmann no longer has a lifetime warranty, unless you purchased or registered your engine before 2005. I think it's now one year, but I'll have to pull the warranty card out of the one new Spectrum engine I bought in the last 5 years to be sure.
 
Bachmann has the best warranty of all. Even after one year they will fix or replace your engine for what i think is a small fee.
I have pruchased several Bachmann, Atlas, Athearn and Broadway Limited engines. On the most part they all take some kind of adjustment or lube when put into service.
Out of 15 Bachmanns recently only one, an SD40-2 needed a new truck, that they sent it free of charge after i called.
One Atlas SD24 had a missing handrail,Atlas sent free of charge.
Two of my Broadway engines had to be sent back because of running problems but they fixed them and they run super now.
I have heard of many problems with Athearn RTR but i must be lucky as all the ones i purchased are OK.
In model railroading you have to learn to do some timkering, adjustment, and minor repair to keep everything running well.
If you shop around you can purchase Bachmann products at very deep discounts, almost 1/2 the price of the others. Many of the deisel running parts are the same and it's almost worth it to purchase a spare unit for parts only.

Bob
 
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Yes, you can get Bachmanns cheap because most people aren't patient enough to deal with them.

They've certainly tested my patience. Every time I opened one up, I had the urge to throw it at the wall. But, if you do enough tinkering, it should run OK.
 
I have 12 locos that are all Bachmann DCC OnBoard bought over the last 5 years.
I have never had any trouble with any of them right out of the box. I "ran them in" properly and even after sitting for 10 months, run like a champ when I place them on the Under-the-xmas-tree-layout for running at Christmas.
Since all the stuff is coming out of the same factory and I have read many threads about faults with $300 locos, I would think it would make more sense to spend less and deal with it there.I don't see spending $300 for a loco that won't run right. If a $50 loco fails, at least I'm not out that much if I get frustrated.
{all washing machines come out of the same factory too, regardless of brand name, capacity or "optional equipment"...we found that out when we went to buy a new washer 2 years ago. SO shop around for the best equipment package you will likely use and the best price- name or price means nothing in terms of quality. If you are in need of a new washer that is.}
Bachmann does have a good warrantee service center in Philly I hear tell...as I said I haven't had to use them.
 
Todays modelers are like the rest of society at large. They want it perfect out of the box every time. The reality is, not gonna happen. Like any mass produced item, there can and will be duds and minor defects that quality control miss. I would love to see some of todays "modelers" go back to the age when a top of the line engine would be a gear driven Athearn, Atlas yellow box w/Roco drive or Brass and deal with getting them up to snuff. Have we as a group become so spoiled that fixing or tweaking minor issues isnt in our realm of ablities? Even high doller brass has issues, either you deal with it yourself, or send it back. I would hope most modelers would try to deal with the issue and in the process learn how to disassemble the model in the process. Most engines I have worked on that come from China, they can be ANY brand mind you, really need a proper lube job before seeing heavy layout use. I have seen trucks devoid of any lube, motor bearings making bad noises after only a couple hours use. Do we send these back just for this issue, I hope not. Now I accept that servicing some of these new models is a major PITA with all the fragile details we now want on them, I perform the service work for many of the local modelers that are unable to themselves. I also hold clinics at the LHS to teach others how to do this. Otherwise I would swamped in service work and unable to work on my own trains. Bachmann's "blue box" DCC/Onboard series is a super value in todays engine market place. If I purchase from a show or a LHS, I make sure to test run the unit prior to any money leaving my wallet. Then if the unit has an issues, its not your problem and you can choose another engine to purchase. If its mail order, then you must be prepared to either deal with any issues or send it back, plain and simple. I personaly am more agrivated by super fraglie plastic handrails that break with the slightest bump. I have been tracking down more older Athearn Blue Box era engines with thier metal handrails, older Atlas yellow box units with thier more flexable handrails, that while they wont hold paint, dont break as easy. If anybody has locomotve problems they cannot solve or need assistance with, shoot me a PM and I can walk you thru dealing with most of them. Nobody likes a dud when you just dropped your hard earned $$ on it, but we are way better off than the modelers of just a generation ago. Now lets go run some trains! Mike
 
Mike;

As posted here recently, no one wants to do things like that. (Here's the thread, http://www.modelrailroadforums.com/forum/showthread.php?t=20997 )

They fully expect a locomotive that may have sat in the factory for 3 months, on a dock in a container for an additional 3 months, on a ship for 3 weeks, another dock sit for several weeks before shipped to company, then another couple of weeks to come out of the box without any problems.

Go Fig.
 
Bachmanns still have a lifetime warranty (check the website), but it's no longer an unconditional one. It's now 100% coverage for one year, with a replacement fee after that. Not as good as it used to be, but still better than others.
 
Cjcrescent said:
Mike;

As posted here recently, no one wants to do things like that. (Here's the thread, http://www.modelrailroadforums.com/forum/showthread.php?t=20997 )

They fully expect a locomotive that may have sat in the factory for 3 months, on a dock in a container for an additional 3 months, on a ship for 3 weeks, another dock sit for several weeks before shipped to company, then another couple of weeks to come out of the box without any problems.

Go Fig.
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I pulled the troublesome unit apart today, and the problem was flashing and trash left on the gears.

You guys are full of beans if you think for a minute that stuff magically "grows" from sitting, or it is a normal part of production and people should expect to disassemble, degrease, debur, and reassemble new products.

It took me about two hours to fix something that was nothing but sloppy parts prep and assembly.

This type of QC is typical of Chinese stuff we get in electronics. We reject about 50-70% of high voltage vacuum tubes because of poor production methods. When RCA was a USA company and made the same tubes, the reject rate was about 1/2 of 1%.

At least we are on the same page about it being a new attitude today. People now expect and accept poor design engineering and poor manufacturing QC. Sloppy work and QC is now a "feature".


Tom
 
Quality control, what quality control lmao! The Chinese have a saying, "Nothing personal, its only business." They cheapen the quality to the point folks start complaining, then bring it back up just a hair so they dont. That way they maximize profits. No, you shouldnt have to take it appart for very glairing issues like flash and trash on the gear teeth. But even USA produced Athearns used to have that issue from time to time, after all its mass produced and things do slip by QC, even when they do have a good QC program in place. Atleast you are able to deal with the problem. Now I know why I tend to stick mostly to older yellow box Atlas engines with either Kato drives or S class switchers with the Roco Austrian drive in them. Rarely did one have issues with either brand of drive back then. Kato still has the best drive hands down, but has stepped away from HO scale right now. Over all the newer Bachmann's sold at the shop have been much more trouble free than any of the Broadway Limited stuff the shop has sold. The LHS has sold boat loads of the Bachmann DCC/Onboard steamers, DD40AX and the smaller diesels. I personaly have 3 of the GP7's with 2 of them having custom chop noses. All run fine and all have thier factory decoders in them. They have better maners on Analog layouts than my engines that have Digitrax decoders in them. Cheers Mike
 
MRLdave said:
Bachmanns still have a lifetime warranty (check the website), but it's no longer an unconditional one. It's now 100% coverage for one year, with a replacement fee after that. Not as good as it used to be, but still better than others.
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There is no more lifetime warranty. Period. "After one year we will repair for a fee" means nothing more than a retail-priced repair like you'd get by bringing your Chevrolet into the dealer for non-warranty repairs.
Here is a scan of a brand-new Spectrum locomotive's warranty sheet spelling it out:
 
Mike;

That's why the only non-brass steamers I have are Spectrums. Brass I know I have to tweak. Always have, always will. These aren't mass produced. The Spectrums are the only China steam I will buy.

TomR said:
You guys are full of beans if you think for a minute that stuff magically "grows" from sitting, or it is a normal part of production and people should expect to disassemble, degrease, debur, and reassemble new products.

It took me about two hours to fix something that was nothing but sloppy parts prep and assembly.

This type of QC is typical of Chinese stuff we get in electronics. We reject about 50-70% of high voltage vacuum tubes because of poor production methods. When RCA was a USA company and made the same tubes, the reject rate was about 1/2 of 1%.

At least we are on the same page about it being a new attitude today. People now expect and accept poor design engineering and poor manufacturing QC. Sloppy work and QC is now a "feature".


Tom
Click to expand...

Tom;

I wasn't referring to something "Growing" while it was idle. I was referring to the grease the Chinese use to lube the locos with. I've "repaired" locos for people that had the lastest locos for a couple of weeks, and the grease in them was dried and cracked. IOW No lube at all. That's not quality control, thats poor materials period!
 
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You steam guys must be having better luck than I am with the Spectrums. I've never met a Bachmann that I didn't want to throw at a wall. Then again, all of the ones I've actually had opened up and fixed are diesels and electrics.
 
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