MTH is vastly superior to DCC


H

hamltnblue

Active Member
Not my words but those of someone in the Train Orders forums.
Here is one post I just did on the forum. The person challenged to compare and listed features. My answers have the A next to them. The forum was in Train Orders. I think I found where the MTH crowd hangs out LOL.

If I missed anything chime in
Using your comparison I'll use the manual linked here from my Blueline Paragon 2 for loco comparison.
The soundraxx Tsunami and QSI decoders are very similar and have some additional features
http://www.broadway-limited.com/support/manuals/Paragon2 Steam Manual (2.11.09).pdf
-------------------------------------------------------
Hamltnblue Wrote:> If that's all they have then
it's far from being equal rather than superior.
There isn't anything >in that link that stands out
and most if not all is available in DCC and then
some.

Oh really? Let's go through this:

* 9 Independent Volume Control Settings - with
DCC you have to program CV's, no CV on DCS and DCS
gives more options
A. The Paragon DCC loco's have 24 independent volume control settings.

* 16 Adjustable Chuff Rate Settings - with DCC you
have to program CV's. Never going to achieve
accuracy without a CAM
A. The Paragon DCC loco above doesn't need chuff rate settings. It's simply alligned with the drivers. The Tsunami has more thatn 16 settings if the cam isn't used and the unit can be tuned to the actual loco.

3 Adjustable Smoke Intensity Settings - Not on
DCC
A. The Paragon 2 has 90 settings. See CV236


* Adjustable Brake Sound Effects - Not on DCC
A. The Paragon 2 has 255 sensitivity setting for break squeal plus the settings for volume. Most higher end DCC Sound decoders have both break sqeal sensitivity and volume adjustment.

* Adjustable Wheel "Clickity-Clack" Sounds - Not
A. The wheels on the trains go clickity clack when the cross a rail joint. no sound effect necessary but some DCC decoders offer it and some allow you to add your own sound. For instance if you want to play pink floyd for a whistle you can do so.

15 Programmable Custom Sounds - Not on DCCA. Read the attached manual. paragon and others offer this

* 4 Adjustable Diesel Engine Ditch Lighting
A. Ditch lights are fully adjustable on just about All Dcc multi function decoders decoders and many more than 4 options.
Effects - DCC you have to program CV's but DCC has
more options here
That's the reason that DCC is superior. you can adjust just about anything the way you want it. Not the way MTH wants it.

* 120 Adjustable Maximum Engine Speed Settings -
A. Same for DCC at 128

* 3 Adjustable Locomotive Direction Start-up
Engines - Not on DCC
A. Not sure what that means.

* Programmable Lash-up Creation - Easier with DCS
but overall accomplishes the same thing as DCC
A. The NCE system does this with a few keystrokes. The latest Digitrax DT402 controller also does it with a couple of keystrokes

* Programmable Route Creation - Equal DCC and DCS,
easier on DCS, both require separate purchase
A. With NCE route programming is included and very simple to do. I'm not sure how digitrax does it but as you know they do.

accessory components
* Programmable Scene Creation - Not on DCC
A. There are numerous options in DCC/Ho in general. Any accessory decoder can activate anything from auto loading to a ferris wheel or whatever you can come up with.

* Record/Playback 90 Minutes of Operation - Not on
DCC
A. The paragon 2 attached will do this easily. Actually it will continue indefinitely if you set it up that way.

* Downloadable Locomotive Sounds Sets - Limited in
DCC to LokSound and QSI only, NYA in HO on DCS but
A. But it is available in DCC. This is the strength of having multiple manufacturers and competition.
MTH can't even produce the programmable sounds and consisting for DCC that they promised in January.

> coming soon
* Independent Locomotive Chronometer - Not on DCC
A. If there is a demand for it someone would produce it. Also MTH has promised other things and many are still waiting.

* Independent Locomotive Odometer - Not on DCC
A. Same

* Independent Locomotive Trip Odometer - Not on
DCC
A. Same
* Independent Locomotive Battery Charge - Not
applicable in HO for either DCS or DCC
* Track Signal Test - Not on DCC, however this is
more of an O gauge feature
A. DCC doesn't have it because there hasn't been a need for it.

* Linear Track Length Meter - Not on DCC
A. DCC typically uses a bus with multiple feeds for short ckt protection. Track length meter not needed since the person laying the track knows how much is there.

* Adjustable 50 or 60Hz AC Input - HO requires DC
input power, DCC systems will accept DC or AC
input power

* 2 Independent Engine Reset Features - Equal to
DCC, system reset and locomotive reset
* 16 TIU Individual Channel Controls - Not on DCC
but also not relevant to HO
A. Yup not revelant but After reading the TIU and controller operation setup I feel bad for DCS users :)

Remote Control Features
* Built-in Microphone - Not on DCC
A. More a gimmick to me. At our club we just use radios or just talk to the people without the controllers. :)

* Back Lit 4-Line LCD Screen - No DCC system has a
4-line display but overall this isn't necessarily
a "feature"
A. I don't know all of the DCC options but the displays are made to accommodate each system.

* 5 Programmable Softkeys with Up to 36 Options -
Not on DCC
A. DCC can program any of the 12 function buttons on the face to do practically anything you want. so in effect every key is a soft key

* Controls Between 4 & 20 Tracks - Equal to DCC
DCC can do as many tracks as you want. Hundreds if you really wanted to. This is because in DCC you control the trins not the track.
Power boosters can be used to continually extend capacity as much as you want. So DCS in no where near DCC if you control tracks.

* Controls Between 20 & 500 Accessories - DCC can
control 1024 accessories attached to accessory
decoders

* Independent Whistle & Bell Sounds - Equal to
DCC
* 120 Speed Steps - DCC has 126 speed steps
A. This was mentioned earlier.

* On-Screen List of Up to 99 Engines - Most DCC
system stacks capable of 256 engines - all up to
9999 addresses

* 42 Levels of Programming Option - DCS is menu
based, DCC has capabilities of thousands through
CV programming

* Labor/Drift Chuffing Sound Control - Not on DCC
without programming and not supported by all
decoders or systems
A. Most modern DCC Sound decoders now support this.

* Diesel Rev Up/Down Sound Control - Not on DCC
A. All of My sound installed diesels have this as auto or manual notching. Auto notching is standard without programming. Also the amount of speed steps per rpm rev change is programmable.
Diesel laboring effects are also included. My Diesel Sound decoders are Tsunami, QSI and Paragon.

* Speed Boost & Brake Control - Not on DCC
A. QSI has brake control using F9. I'm not sure about the others.

* One Touch Smoke On/Off Control - Equal to DCC

* One Touch Volume Level Control - Not on DCC
A. My paragons use F8 to control volume. I'm not sure about the settings on Tsunami or QSI.

* Engine Sounds Mute Button - Equal to DCC
* One Touch Headlight On/Off Control - Equal to
DCC

* One Touch Proto-Cast™ Control - Not on DCC
decoders, but for MTH decoders, activation equal
to DCC
A. Don't know what proto-cast control is.

* One Touch Coupler Operation Control - Not on DCC
decoders, but for MTH decoders, activation equal
to DCC
A. First thing I did with my MTH SD70 auto couplers was throw them out. They don't look like anything I've ever seen on a train.

* One Touch Engine Startup Control - Equal to DCC
* One Touch Engine Shutdown Control - Equal to
DCC
* One Touch Passenger or Freight Sound Activation
- Not on DCC decoders, but for MTH decoders,
activation equal to DCC
A. Both Paragon and Tsunami's have this. Actually QSI can make any sound you want.

Ok let's tally up:
You might want to re-tally because if that's all DCS has you only covered less than half of what DCC has.
DCS Better -
DCC Better -
Both Equal -
DCS Feature not relevant to HO -

Not listed here is the way DCS interfaces to the
user which is far easier than DCC since you don't
need a computer to get the English description of
what settings you're modifying.
A. that's a matter of opinion for each user. I think the NCE is as easy. Digitrax has a bit of a learning curve but after a day of ops it's just as easy to operate IMO.

Well there's a loss of 45 minites LOL
 
97% of all that can be done with regular DCC. Some people will go the MTH route and preach that its the best as much as some choose NCE over Digitrax, Lenz over NCE, Etc. Etc. Etc. Is DCS Superior, LOL No. Hell you can make a steam whistle sound from a tyco billboard so big deal. DCS is just another form of control. But you cant say a system is superior just by features. I can take any DCC loco and run it on ANY DCC layout and get similar results now try that with a DCS system loco. My friend got 2 DCS MTH SD70ACEs and constantly has issues running them on a Digitrax Club layout and forget about MUing them with say a non sound DCC Atlas loco as they wont run together very well. Now if you ONLY run DCS locos on a DCS layout then you will have great results but toss something odd into the loop and forget it as problems will arise. I know what the DCS masters say, Just speed match all your DCC locos to the MTH ones, LOL. Well I do not plan on changing 200+ locos so they can play nice with 1 or 2. DCS is more for the O scale 3 Rail crowd as it seams that each manufacturer MTH, Lionel, Etc has their own system for controlling advanced features. For HO there is just to much out there in DCC to try and toss in something completely different and expect everyone to jump on it. I remember DCC when it was new and Co.s such as Marklin and Hornby Zero 1 had nice setups. We have come a long way from those days and even though things can still improve a little most of the DCS additional features are more of gimmicks then anything.
 
I think that the problem the MTH crowd has is they think that DCC is still the same as the old days. All they have to do is go to a train show or 2 and they can see that 99% of the loco's and other electronic gadgets don't work on their DCS systems.
 
Mth dcs???

So they say MTH is superior to DCC huh? Ask them where their trains are you can't hardly find the loco's you want and I feel most of the steams are way over priced. Talk to dealers and ask them when the trains will arrive and most will say "Who knows." I bought one BNSF SD70 Ace. Yes the sound is great but so is Tsunami. I had to send mine back to the factory because the sound quit and they replaced the sound system. I got the engine back in about four weeks. I will stick with DCC because there are good quality sound decoders that can be programed to do most of the things DCS can do. One thing to remember is stick with what works, the grass always looks greener on the other side of the tracks. Besides, how many functions can an operator do when there are several different trains running at the same time?They have whistles and bells and so do I. What's really unique, mine are available, what about MTH?????:eek:
Jack Strong from Star, Idaho:
 
The QSI sound decoders I have come with a verbal readout of locomotive speed, and a verbal odometer can be added with the change of a couple of CV's
I'm not sure what a DCS chronometer is, but I think an odometer would be more useful.
 
I think the DCS option is neat, but unnecessary for my use.

The biggest fault? No aftermarket decoders for none DCS equipped units. If I wanted DCS, I can't run ANY of my Athearn, Atlas, Kato, Broadway, ect, locomotives (as far as I know).
 
Nice response Blue. Well put. But it's like arguing politics. Futile. They won't listen because their minds are already made up. Facts will just confuse them ;). It comes down to this for me: If I wanted three rail features, I'd buy three rail trains. (with all due respect to the three railers on the list! :D) Smoke and talkies are toyish IMHO. I can just imagine an operating session at my club with 8 or 9 smokers. The stink, and what it would do to the track, scenery and other models. Our club has banned smoke.

Many of these supposed superior features are things I don't give a rip about. It needs to work, be reliable, relatively easy to use, and work and play well with my existing stuff. If it doesn't do that, it isn't coming home with me, no matter how "good" it is.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.



Back
Top