Lionel HO GP-9 "GM 50" Chessie / B&O


It depends on which decoder is installed so check the decoder manual. Many DCC decoders have an 'analog' mode that allows them to run with DC power but some decoders do not have this feature. Also, this 'analog' mode feature can be disabled and you need a DCC system to change the CV to enable it.
 
I got my Lionel HO "GM 50" GP 9 it's the original Lionel made single power truck. At first it locked up but after I took it apart I see that the pad on the shell was dry rotted and the shell is used to secure the motor to the frame. The pad was allowing the motor to rise up when torque was applied and the is what caused it to lock up. I replace the pad and now it runs great! Now I want to find one with dual power trucks made by Lionel.
 
Selector said:
Most modern DCC decoders, but for certain ALL modern sound decoders, will operate on either DC or DCC. The decoder will come from the factory able to determine which form of power is getting to the rails. You can configure the decoder to only operate on DCC by changing the value of CV 29 to a value of 34. With a value of 38, the decoder will retain its 'dual-mode' status and react to the type of power it senses from the rails.
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Great info. I have wondered this also. Nice to know.
 
I found this picture and I thought someone might like it as much as I do.

Louis

GM50_03.jpg
 
Here is somethings I discovered that I found to be interesting.

Since I have gotten interested in these Lionel HO GP 9 locomotives from the 70's I have collected 8 of them in various condition for restoration. I am hoping to have 3 locomotives in excellent condition when I am done. My next project will be to add a DCC decoder. If it is not feasible to add a DCC decoder I will still have 3 great looking and running DC locomotives for my DC track.

As I read during my research there are several variations from the 2 different manufactures. Lionel with American made power trucks, chassis and GE motors. With Canadian made shells. The Kader/Bachmann is made in Hong Kong for Lionel. So far I have found the Lionel made locomotives have 3 different weights, 2 different frames, 2 different shells and come with single or dual power trucks. I have only come across 2 differ variations of the Kader/Bachmann made for Lionel with the only difference being the types of weights and frames.

One of the discoveries I find to be interesting is if you take the Original Lionel Shell from 1974 with the metal weight built into the shell and put it on the Kader/Bachman that has plate type weights you get a very heavy, great pulling engine! Best of all there are no modifications need to do it, the shell snaps on perfectly. Contrary to what I have heard the Kader/Bachmann runs very smooth and quiet. Now I must add that my opinion must be taken with a grain of salt because I think Tyco's Alco 630 runs smooth and quiet as well. I don not own any high end HO locomotives.

I have yet to tear down one of the Kader/Bachmann motors to see if it is feasible to isolate the motor from the frame. If I can isolate the motor it will be very easy to install a NEC D13SR DCC decoder.

The Lionel Motor appears to be very easy to isolate and can also use the NEC D13SR DCC decoder provided that the motor is isolated from the frame.

I believe the Kader/Bachmann motors are referred to as "pancake" motors. If anyone has added a DCC decoder to a diesel locomotive with this type motor or the Lionel/GE motors I would be interested in hearing about your experience.

A word of caution if you are planning on trying this. NCE support has warned me that the motor must be isolated from the frame for this decoder. I also suggest you read the decoder manual thoroughly before you get started. I downloaded the manual right after I received the recommendation to use the D13SR DCC decoder from NCE. http://www.ncedcc.com/images/stories/manuals/d13v35_d.pdf
I intend to start a new thread “What is the best DCC Decoder to add to 1970’s diesel Locomotives?” I highly value the input and experience of the model railroaders on this site.

I know to some of you this may sound like a fools venture, but I am enjoying it. The whole reason I play with my toy trains is to have fun.

I wanted to share this incase there are any others who maybe interested.

Louis
 
Mate, the whole purpose is to have fun, enjoy whatever part of this hobby gives you satisfaction. Unfortunately there are too many who think their way is the only way and they get some distorted pleasure out of forcing others to follow suit.
 
Hey King Toot!

I am with you 100% I have a too much fun sometimes, it seems it should be illegal!

They won't persuade me.

Good to hear from you!

Louis

tootnkumin said:
Mate, the whole purpose is to have fun, enjoy whatever part of this hobby gives you satisfaction. Unfortunately there are too many who think their way is the only way and they get some distorted pleasure out of forcing others to follow suit.
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Louis, those old pancake-type motors should be easy to isolate, since there is a wire going to the non-powered truck from one motor brush, and a wire going to the pickup on the powered truck from the other motor brush.
 
Just an update, for various reason I have yet to make any further progress with my DCC conversion of these old Lionel HO locomotives. I've put my entire HO endeavor on hold for now other then reading research and buying things I don't need.

I've been focusing on my O gauge layout but all I really did with that was set it up for Christmas.

Now little league baseball season is approaching and I will be busy with my grandsons. One of the few things in my life that is better then playing with my trains is playing with my boys!

I don't know when I will get back to this, but God willing I will!

I thought I would post this to let other procrastinators and in my case, people unable to stay on point, always shifting from one thing to another, you are not alone. The good news is we have no deadlines and nobody can fire us!

I am having fun with my trains, I hope everyone else is too!

to be continued.
 
Bruette, I am sorry that you feel that people here aren't taking you seriously. I really want you to know that I do take you seriously and am interested in what you are doing. I like old and sometimes funky stuff. I have a pair of ALCO RS-2's on a shelf, one of which is the best running loco I own (re-motored) that I worked my butt off on in the 1980's. I wouldn't part with them for anything. I'll run em too, make book on it.

Have fun, do what you want to. Your friends will support you. I'll be looking for those GP-9s you like too. I'm sure you could use more. And I'll continue to enjoy your posts! I was amazed that your loco had a shaver motor in it... that was really suprising. Head on bro.
 
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This is why I enjoy this forum so much, the people on here are the best!


Thank you Jim,

I don't let anyone rain on my parade. I got some flak about my Lionel HO endeavor but they were just trying to help me and save me some money. They did not realize my sentimental reasons for following this. I realize I could better spend my money on new things, but I am having fun with this! Your RS-2s are a perfect example, sometimes the journey is as good as the destination.

Also thank you for the link to eBay, I placed a bid for as high as I was willing to go but I was out bid. I learned my lesson with eBay. I go as high as I think its worth, but no higher. There is always another auction coming along.

You are right about collecting, people collect the strangest things, but to each his own. If they are not hurting anyone and having fun then its all good!



Thank you Terry,

I did not know Athearn made locomotives for Lionel! I have only one printed source of information about Lionel HO in the 70s and it does not mention Athearn. I have a dozen Lionel HO GP9 locomotives and so far I have only found the Lionel American made and the Kader/Bachmann made in Hong Kong. This is fascinating, looking at the link you sent me I can see Athearn GP9 look like the exact same shell as the Lionel American made GP9. There are subtle differences between the made by Lionel and the made for Lionel Kader/Bachmann. I don't see any difference in the Athearn. I have to pull out my magnifying glass and an American made Lionel!

Thank you for the link! I love reading about my trains, its the next best thing to playing with them! The problem is, to use Lionel HO in the 70s for example, I have only found one book and it never mentioned Athearn. One source is not a definitive answer. I read Tony Cooks web page and now I see in 1958 Athearn made them for Lionel and now I understand why they look the same. Looks like Lionel used the same tooling when they came back to HO in the 70's. I like to know all the details!

I think the Athearn GP9 could be a source for parts, if nothing else the hand rails will work and it looks like the chassis will too! I could even get a B&O and a Chessie/B&O shell. Lionel's Chessie is a C&O, not for me. I have a lot more to learn, this will be fun!

I don't concern myself that everything is original. I don't have any problem with a "Frankenstein" model, I just want it to run good and look good! I am sure I will end up with at least 1 hybrid; Lionel/Athearn/Kader-Bachmann, maybe even running DCC!



Thank you both very much for your support and assistance, if I can ever return the favor please don't hesitate to ask!
 
Louis, for a time I worked with Chester Holley in his hobby shop, back in the dark ages. I found an entire box of the Lionel GP9s--shipped from Compton, California (home of Athearn).
 
tootnkumin said:
Mate, the whole purpose is to have fun, enjoy whatever part of this hobby gives you satisfaction. Unfortunately there are too many who think their way is the only way and they get some distorted pleasure out of forcing others to follow suit.
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I couldn't agree more! Unfortunately there are "Prima Donna's" every where, even in the model railroad community. Thankfully, I haven't come across any as yet, at least not here any way :)

Cheers and do what makes the hobby fun for you Louis, who cares what others might or might not think ;)
 
Terry,

After what I learned from you I looked at some Athearn GP9 locomotives and the Walthers Trainline looks like it could be the same shell as well. At least it looks like if fastens to the chassis the same way. I found one on Amazon for $35 and ordered it so I will find out soon enough. Its a CSX so even if it does not fit I will still have a locomotive I will enjoy! This one does not have DCC but some others do and how cool will that be to see my old Lionel GP9 running with a brand new chassis with dual fly wheels.

I am having way to much fun, this can't be legal, somebody is going to call the law!




wombat457,

Amen Brother!
 
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Louis, not only did Athearn make loco's and cars for Lionel, so did Rivarossi. This was during the foray into HO back in the 1960's.
 
Hey Doctor,

I did not know that. I have some Lionel HO rolling stock from the 70s that are made in Austria, do you know who made those?

I am going to have to look in the forum bookstore for the book about Lionel HO in the 50s and 60s. I did not realize so much of it carried over into the 70s.
 
Those were probably made by Roco. What's interesting about most, if not all of Lionel's forays into HO is that Lionel never actually made any HO. They were always made by someone else for Lionel. Even the latest stuff from Lionel was actually made in Korea by a company called Korea Brass.

The only trains Lionel has ever made was the Standard Gauge, O, O-27, and some American Flyer after Gilbert went out of business.
 
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