Critique please, bedroom switching layout plan


T

TheGloriousTachikoma

Member
So, I'll soon have my room back to myself. Realizing the potential, I took a tape measure to it and was delighted to find that it is slightly larger than the room I tried to build my last layout in. So, I'm increasing the likelihood of getting this one to operational status. I've compiled a list of givens and wants and think I have a solid plan to work with.

Givens:
-11.5'x13' room
-Three doorways must be easily accessed at all times
-Must function as a bedroom with comfortable capacity for me and up to one guest, plus my dog

Wants (I'm sorry, I'm too young for 'druthers'.) :
-Modern switching (no spots fewer than two cars, usually more)
-As a result, relatively prototypical train lengths (8-10 50' cars)
-Continuous running
-Sunny theme

So, imagine my delight to find this page on SIG
http://www.macrodyn.com/ldsig/wiki/...med_LA_switching_layout_-_HO_-_Michael_Powell

This plan was nearly perfect and my adaptation in SCARM resulted in a 13' long plan. Expanding the short leg out to fit the width of my bedroom, and adding a peninsula to use the top of an L-shaped computer hutch, I now have this:

http://sadpanda.us/images/1144920-HD1DJOY.jpg

I've already added the necessary requisites to continue a loop around the room. I had the idea of adding small Iain Rice style shadow boxes between the doors and connect them with lift-ins. But for the meantime...how does this plan look? The curve at the bottom of the short side would be hidden by scenery/structures, and the tracks there are flexible anyway. I took the two-track yard and put it out over top of the computer hutch and tried to keep the tracks straight enough to still couple reliably.

I'm not sure yet on operation specifics, but essentially a cut is brought out from staging, sorted, and the local crew works a given section or list of clients in the district. Planned primary motive power will be a LPG genset-converted SD45 with either similarly converted SW1500 or Geep

So I'm just asking for critiques on this plan, as well as offered advice. One point is that I don't have any engine servicing on this plan. I don't need a gaudy roundhouse, just someplace where Big Grunt and Little Grunt get parked when off shift for refueling. One idea is that they just get parked by the LPG dealer who's contracted to provide fueling.

I have a good idea of what the remaining industries will be. I'd originally planned 'C' to be a team track, but I'm now thinking to make it the LPG dealer since the spur is only about long enough for two of those big tankers. A potential deal on some Roundhouse 50' tank cars has me thinking to make 'G' a waste oil recycler. And I'm thinking that 'F' can be a paper recycler owned by the same company. And 'H' and 'I' can just be random boxcar warehouses with names like 'RACO' or 'ARDCO'. 'B' was planned to be a scrapyard but that kinda clashes with the theme I'm going for. Would be nice to have some 65' gondolas for variety though. :)

I am thinking that the yard may not be needed. In which case I'll just add an extension to the runaround, make it an interchange point, and turn the yard into a small intermodal terminal. :D

Thanks for the time and any opinions.
 
As a track plan, I don't see much that will cause problems. Switching industry H when there is a car in front of industry F will cause you extra switching moves to clear the spur, but that may seem interesting to you instead of a problem.

I prefer as little track as possible. There is probably a way for the layout to accomplish the same thing using a little less track, but I haven't really looked at it closely.

Seems like a reasonable plan; however, I can't see how you, a guest, your dog, and a peninsula are going to fit comfortably in that room.
 
Doughless said:
As a track plan, I don't see much that will cause problems. Switching industry H when there is a car in front of industry F will cause you extra switching moves to clear the spur, but that may seem interesting to you instead of a problem.

I prefer as little track as possible. There is probably a way for the layout to accomplish the same thing using a little less track, but I haven't really looked at it closely.

Seems like a reasonable plan; however, I can't see how you, a guest, your dog, and a peninsula are going to fit comfortably in that room.
Click to expand...

Dog is usually in the bathroom where the cool linoleum is. :) And the peninsula is atop my computer hutch. 0" on the layout will be about 54" above the floor.

I had some ideas this morning. I decided to nix any potential for continuous running and added a turntable and a two-stall engine house. The tail of the staging is not tucked behind a lift-out fascade. Biggest change is I expanded the yard and added a drop-leaf that comes up for operating sessions (high enough to duck under). Yard now will comfortably hold more cars than are allotted to fit on all the industrial spurs.

http://sadpanda.us/images/1147106-5H9AJEI.jpg

I know how you feel, Doughless. The twin spurs at 'B' are more just because I'm not sure what I want to go there. It could be just a single spur into a junkyard or in front of whatever industry I decide to put there. Conceivably 'G' and 'D' could share the same spur, but an oil recycler and a lumberyard kinda need their own spurs. The crossover between 'G' and 'F' is more for convenience so that the entire runaround doesn't have to be negotiated. The track between the spurs for 'H' and 'I' is merely a continuation of the mainline. I don't see how any track can be pared off the design as it is.
 
Reasonable enough track plan but I think that you will be very cramped and banging into your layout with a 54 inch height. Maybe you should consider N scale.:)
 
Burlington Bob said:
Reasonable enough track plan but I think that you will be very cramped and banging into your layout with a 54 inch height. Maybe you should consider N scale.:)
Click to expand...

The past month I've invested about...$200 building a fleet of HO rolling stock
I'm locked in to HO now. I don't think I'll be banging into the layout. The shelf on the top of the plan is only 15" wide. I can narrow the 24" wide section along the short side by eliminating the space for a road between the tracks, but that's over my bed anyway. I wouldn't even need to leave the central 'pit' when the drop-leaf is up, I'd just need a marker post where the uncoupling magnet is down by 'B'
 
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Might want to try a mockup from cardboard before you build the actual layout. Try it for a week or so to see how you do for clearance, etc. It may be fine as is. One thing for sure though, it's a lot easier to change the shape of a piece of cardboard than benchwork for a layout. Good luck, Bob.
 
TheGloriousTachikoma said:
I can narrow the 24" wide section along the short side by eliminating the space for a road between the tracks, but that's over my bed anyway.
Click to expand...

And your bed (and guest bed) is how big? Is it 2 feet wide or more? Are you planning to reach stuff on the layout while standing on your knees in bed, or standing on the floor reaching in across the bed and the shelf?

How tall is your bed? Are you planning to crawl sideways into bed under the layout, without being able to sit up in bed?

The track plan seems nice enough. The only thing several of us question a little is how well the layout will coexist with the use of the room as a two bed bedroom.

Smile,
Stein
 
steinjr said:
And your bed (and guest bed) is how big? Is it 2 feet wide or more? Are you planning to reach stuff on the layout while standing on your knees in bed, or standing on the floor reaching in across the bed and the shelf?

How tall is your bed? Are you planning to crawl sideways into bed under the layout, without being able to sit up in bed?

The track plan seems nice enough. The only thing several of us question a little is how well the layout will coexist with the use of the room as a two bed bedroom.

Smile,
Stein
Click to expand...

No guest bed, I meant guest in room 'hanging out'. My old full-size mattress will be too big, I'm thinking a twin. Maybe even a futon-couch, I'm fairly fond of them.
 
TGT
The pix in the SIG link sure look alot like the Los Angeles Junction Ry that I'm modeling, Just not the same areas shown in the pix. Doing a PowerPoint clinic on the LAJ 9/6/12 630-730P at the NMRA PSR convention 9/5-9/9/12 in Oxnard CA. You don't have to be an NMRA member to attend: http://www.psrnmra.org/
Here's a long link to the slides:
https://plus.google.com/photos/107389354387456095061/albums/5776602864442569041?banner=pwa
And a short version: http://tinyurl.com/9as5pxs
Shown are the LAJ Switching Maps along w/notes by Charlie Slater who was a conductor there '70-'84 then ATSF/BNSF til retirement. As can be seen the LAJ is nothing but a bunch of "Leads" radiating out from the yards. Only doing about 6-8 of the Vernon leads & the A Yard on my 12' x 14' layout w/ ALOT of selective compression!
 
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TheGloriousTachikoma said:
Dog is usually in the bathroom where the cool linoleum is. :) And the peninsula is atop my computer hutch. 0" on the layout will be about 54" above the floor.

I had some ideas this morning. I decided to nix any potential for continuous running and added a turntable and a two-stall engine house. The tail of the staging is not tucked behind a lift-out fascade. Biggest change is I expanded the yard and added a drop-leaf that comes up for operating sessions (high enough to duck under). Yard now will comfortably hold more cars than are allotted to fit on all the industrial spurs.

http://sadpanda.us/images/1147106-5H9AJEI.jpg

I know how you feel, Doughless. The twin spurs at 'B' are more just because I'm not sure what I want to go there. It could be just a single spur into a junkyard or in front of whatever industry I decide to put there. Conceivably 'G' and 'D' could share the same spur, but an oil recycler and a lumberyard kinda need their own spurs. The crossover between 'G' and 'F' is more for convenience so that the entire runaround doesn't have to be negotiated. The track between the spurs for 'H' and 'I' is merely a continuation of the mainline. I don't see how any track can be pared off the design as it is.
Click to expand...

I'll leave your room usage and tolerance for crampness to your own judgment.

A modern shortline would not have a turntable. If they inherited one when they took over a former class 1 branch line, they probably wouldv'e filled it in to save ongoing costs. Turntables also take up valuable space on a model railroad, especially on a small layout, so I don't think that was a good addition to the new plan.

If I was planning on using the yard a lot, I would rather put it on one of the fixed shelves, leaving the peninsula and its fold down tracks for a less-used industry or even a single interchange/fiddle track, and maybe two tracks with an engine house for servicing. Fewer tracks to fold and fewer cars strung together over the fold mean less headaches, IMO.
 
Not honestly wishing to throw a lot of cold water on this project, but many of us have layout dreams that are really far beyond what is practical. I'm afraid this is such an instance.

Assuming that you are a teen and building the layout in your parents' home, I would have to say that your current layout design, considering the actual purpose the room is intended for and the space the layout will take up would be unacceptable to most family situations. It is one thing to place a modest, relatively narrow, shelf layout on one, or perhaps two, walls of a bedroom. It is honestly impractical to have layout as large as this one in a modest-sized bedroom, especially when it impinges on the central area of that room.

You must appreciate that this location is a bedroom first, not an actual spare room. The design as currently purposed, shared with a regularly occupied space intended for distinctly other purposes, simply doesn't fly. If built the room will unquestionable prove impractical for either use.

In my opinion it would be far better to employ the original "switching pike for a spare room" design, perhaps even truncating it to being on just one wall, with the option to extending it to a second wall in the future IF the first construction stage proves practical and fully functional. Over-designing and impractical layout size have always been common pitfalls for younger modelers and generally results in a disappointing project on completion. My advice would be to go back to the drawing board and create something simpler, more practical, and smaller in size.

NYW&B
 
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Understandable, NY. You are largely correct in your estimation of my circumstances. However, as I've said, the peninsula follows the shape of a L-shaped computer hutch that I have had in such a position before. With two people sharing the room it didn't fly, but I'm confident that singly occupied it can work.

I am taking doughless's advice and redesigning it to relocate the yard and do like how it's turning out. There is no more need for the drop leaf and I've been able to trim down the width of the shelf a bit. The railroad also has a dedicated interchange point visible on the layout which makes me happier and means this can officially be a self-contained shortline/industrial railroad.
 
http://sadpanda.us/images/1152459-7U81ER5.jpg

Latest revision. Yard has been taken down a track, relocated and the runaround has been made into a dedicated interchange. Also removed the shipping aspect of Master Moulder and now it just receives plastic pellets. I also decided that both of EcoDay's facilities should be on one property. The short side has been slimmed down 2" and the long side is up to 8" shallower. And, no drop-leaf off of the computer-hutch supported penninsula.

The spur that the lumber yard is on looks rather under-used though. The problem is that curve is 22"R. Spotting cars one it would not yield reliable coupling. One idea I had was to eliminate the 'continuing main' on the far left and place the lumberyard there, and then have the track for Sunresan Decadance share some marshy land, maybe a continuance of the river that will separate the yard and the LPG dealer.

[EDIT]
http://sadpanda.us/images/1152583-75THJF2.jpg

Muuuuch better. Less track and more room for scenery and structures. Still don't quite know what to do with that last spur though. I don't want the plan to feel too unbalanced. I want this 'district' to be comparable to the other in terms of activity. That's the only real concrete upside to the original I came-up with in that it had two 'districts' each with similar levels of activity.
 
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What if you made the two tracks at "a" staging tracks. You still have a siding in front of "A" to spot cars. A train would come in from staging. drop off cars at the yard and take a train from the yard back to staging. Then you would have to sort the cars at the yard then send them out to the industries.
Looks like a fun little layout.

Steve
 
TheGloriousTachikoma said:
http://sadpanda.us/images/1152459-7U81ER5.jpg

Latest revision. Yard has been taken down a track, relocated and the runaround has been made into a dedicated interchange. Also removed the shipping aspect of Master Moulder and now it just receives plastic pellets. I also decided that both of EcoDay's facilities should be on one property. The short side has been slimmed down 2" and the long side is up to 8" shallower. And, no drop-leaf off of the computer-hutch supported penninsula.

The spur that the lumber yard is on looks rather under-used though. The problem is that curve is 22"R. Spotting cars one it would not yield reliable coupling. One idea I had was to eliminate the 'continuing main' on the far left and place the lumberyard there, and then have the track for Sunresan Decadance share some marshy land, maybe a continuance of the river that will separate the yard and the LPG dealer.

[EDIT]
http://sadpanda.us/images/1152583-75THJF2.jpg

Muuuuch better. Less track and more room for scenery and structures. Still don't quite know what to do with that last spur though. I don't want the plan to feel too unbalanced. I want this 'district' to be comparable to the other in terms of activity. That's the only real concrete upside to the original I came-up with in that it had two 'districts' each with similar levels of activity.
Click to expand...

You will need the empty track on the peninsula to switch the switchback that leads to C. Unless, any industry that is placed on the empty track uses 1 or 2 cars only, and the train going to C is 1 or 2 cars only. Then there may be enough track length to have cars spotted at the new industry and still be able to clear the switch heading to C without moving the spotted cars first. This is where more precise planning and measuring comes into play. It may even come down to whether or not the industries need to use cars no longer than 50 footers in order for everything to fit.

And, as just an observation and a matter of personal preference, the yard might work better if the tracks pointed to the right, instead of to the left. Assume the tracks beneath A are used for an interchange, and also that industry A takes your longest string of cars. The locomotive would have to always run around the train in order to take a string of cars from the interchange to the yard, or to take a string of cars from the yard to industry A. By having the yard facing to the right, you can swap long cuts of cars out of the yard and to the interchange or A without running around the train.

While I like switching layouts, constantly running around trains can get annoying. You'll probably have enough runaround moves on the layout to keep things interesting as it is now, since there is an almost equal amount of spurs facing both directions.

In short, if you moved the yard to NE corner of the layout, an even to the outside of the main, the layout might operate more efficiently. And I think the tracks on the right side can be shortened to give you the room. The tracks behind building A do not have to be as long as you have them now anyway. You can keep the benchwork slim in the corner by consolidating the two curved tracks into one, by using a curved turnout.

Again, all of this is a matter of personal preference.
 
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Well, I just thought that alot of the industries would be on a scheduled delivery and that when the LPG dealer was getting switched, that industry could be as well, so the siding could be cleared as needed. I've tried not to get to the point where I needed to count quarters of an inch, as that would get into the timesaver/puzzle mentality. I am building this layout with the eventual intent of pushing decently-sized cuts of cars back and forth, nothing more complex than that. All I'm checking is that the sidings are long enough (like

I was thinking that the yard should be flipped in some way, and you do have a point about running around all the time. I'm reworking the plan. I just want to use as few curved turnouts as possible since...well, expensive.
 
Yes, I was just offering up one suggestion. Thinking further, there are better ways to flip the yard.

It'll be interesting to see your adjustment.

Its easier to play around with the design and different operating situations at this point than later.
 
http://sadpanda.us/images/1153369-B2ZDH7O.jpg

I kinda like how this revision turned out. there's a nice pocket for scenery, the shelf is no wider (at maximum) than before, and the yard isn't up front and prominent.

But I'm thinking that second runaround isn't necessary. My initial thought was to allow the yard to be switched while the local can make its runarounds. But then I realized that the yard isn't big enough to need an unencumbered drill and this RR only has two locomotives, and alot of the time they get MU'ed together. I had hoped that there would be a way to make this a two-operator layout but it just isn't big enough given the size of the equipment.

Though getting rid of the second runaround eliminates one of the curved turnouts and makes the curve into the right-side district a bit gentler.
 
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