Removing a factory fitted sound decoder

[tootnkumin]

As this is my first foray into the servicing of sound equipped locos, I just need a pointer or two as to the correct method of removing the sound board from my newly aquired Genesis FP45.

I want to take the board out so I can put a spot of oil onto the motor bearings before commissioning the loco for heavy freight haulage. In the case of this model the motor and the board on it's top are housed in a channel in the frame which makes access to those bearings impossible
From the cab end

From the rear

It's also not possible to grip the board from the sides either, so my question is, will lifting from the ends risk snapping the board if the plug is tight or would it be advisable to prise it up with a piece of plastic from each side till it's loose?

An interesting thing I noticed is that there is provision to mount a second speaker (or maybe it's an alternative location) at the front and there appears to be enough clearance from other components to do so. A good idea to have an additional speaker?


The speaker sits into the round recesses in the frame sides and has small lugs on the enclosure that locate into the notches in the frame.

[MGWSY]

There are 2 black plasic clips that the board snaps into. Just pop the board off them and lift the decoder up a little. Just be careful as you will have wires going to the motor and hard to say how short they are. But you should have enough room to oil the motor bearings.

[tootnkumin]

Ah yes, I see the clips you are referring to (they show up better in the photo actually). Nothing about them in the instruction sheets of course, and after having to deal with a coupling that totally refused to slip out of it's pocket and the sides of the body where they were stuck to the frame with paint (the biggest blobs being behind the air tanks and inaccesible to a blade), I thought I'd seek some advise before tearing out more hair (or in my case, scalp). Thanks MGWSY, I'll let you know how I get on.

[tootnkumin]

To continue,
These are the clips referred to, they are of the spring hook type i.e. press the part over them and they spring out to hold it, nice and easy for putting together but a pain to get the part back off again because they are strong and because the edge is bevelled and the hole they pass through is only big enough to pass the hook through. The danger here is that if you push against the bevel you're liable to slip and rip something off the board
This is them

What I did was to use my smallest flat tipped screwdriver and carefully push it between the hook of the clip and the circuit board and lever the hook back while applying a bit of lift to the board which released it. The other clip then slipped off easily.

These 2 clips are attached to a plastic mount that fits over the motor

and in my engine's case was able to be lifted slightly at the front end but didn't seem to want to do so at the back (the motor wiring twisted around the front pervented it lifting any further anyway

At the front there are two "legs" that fit down past the motor bearing which is accessable for oiling

At the back end, there is only a narrow slot that slides past the motor shaft and there is very little room to get any oiling device down to the bearing (which you also cannot see) I usually use a piece of fine wire with a flattened end to place a drop of oil onto bearings. The problem here is even that would lose the oil onto the flywheel or clip before it got anywhere near the shaft.


It may be that this plastic mounting can be lifted off the motor but I hate forcing anything unless I know that it won't break or that nothing else will get damaged. The exploded view of parts doesn't even show this mounting so that's no help, so it may be necessary to remove the motor to find out.

[diburning]

I don't know if the board cradle is part of the motor mount, but on the Genesis SD45-2, it is not, it simply clips into place.

[tootnkumin]

Originally Posted by diburning

I don't know if the board cradle is part of the motor mount, but on the Genesis SD45-2, it is not, it simply clips into place.

I suspected that it would just be clipped, probably hooked under the rear of the motor 'cause that's the end that's not lifting free. The front end appears to be clipped around the bearing housing and will require the motor wires to be untwisted to get it up.

If it's like the clips that hold the board to the cradle then it'll hold very firmly (totally unnecessary for them to be so firm, it's not as though it can go anywhere), so a bit more prising and fiddling to see if it will come free. What makes it difficult is of course is not being able to get side access to it because of the frame. Good for extra weight, but.

[tootnkumin]

Well I eventually got this one sorted out, took pics if anyones interested.

Not having a lot of luck with these FP45's, have now got 4 of them, the 2 latest another red and silver warbonnet, the other a freight in the yellow and blue warbonnet, both DCC ready. Silver one arrived in a totally unmarked, undamaged packaging but I noticed the horns on the cab front were bent down slightly, odd I thought.

Took it out of it's box, tested it, OK, and straightened up the horns. Then I saw in the foam packaging above where the horns were (there's quite a space above and at the ends of the loco) the distinct impression of where the horns had been driven into the foam. The engine is held in place by being screwed (at the fuel tank mounting) to a piece of 3/4" thick MDF which locks into the foam at each end with packing wedges. You would never imagine in a 1000 years that anything could move it. But here it was, this piece of board had been cracked just ahead of the front screw and had a bend in it.
It must have taken one hell of a whack to do this, but absolutely no outward sign of it. So, has someone screwed me over (again) or has the package received a blow while in with other parcels and it's just been the weight of the engine (they're heavy) that moved it? Guess I'll never know.

But wait! there's more.
The NIB freight loco arrived 2 days later in a package that looked like it had done 10 rounds with Mike Tyson, so with great trepidation I opened it. Not a mark on the Genesis packet or the loco.

So, out of the box and onto the track, hooray! the lights came on and she rolled forward, reversed it down to the end of my 15' test track and stopped. Switched to forward on the controller, lights on..........nothing, no movement. "Ah, dead spot on the track", moved it, no go.

The upshot after resoldering all the connections, checking the brushes etc, etc, powering the motor directly with seemingly no luck, it did a spin, and stopped again. Marked the spot on a flywheel and rotated it slightly, and away it went merrily. Has 2 dead spots @ 180deg apart of about 5deg rotation.

What gets me is, I must have tried that thing a half dozen times or more, after removing and refitting to the frame and every time the armature has landed on those spots every time.

I'm developing a great aversion to NIB eBay listings(oh yeah, although the parts diagram was with it, there's no warranty card or advertising from Athearn). So NIB......BS.

But I'm talking nicely to the seller in the hope he'll come to the party with either a new motor or a partial refund, don't really want to send it back if I can avoid it. Have also contacted Athearn to see about the availability and price of a new motor so I've got something to go on.

[diburning]

Originally Posted by tootnkumin

But here it was, this piece of board had been cracked just ahead of the front screw and had a bend in it.
It must have taken one hell of a whack to do this, but absolutely no outward sign of it. So, has someone screwed me over (again) or has the package received a blow while in with other parcels and it's just been the weight of the engine (they're heavy) that moved it? Guess I'll never know.

Engine was probably dropped while it was out of the styrofoam cradle. A force strong enough to crack/break that composite wood block that the engine is screwed to would destroy the styrofoam first, so it wasn't shipping damage.

Originally Posted by tootnkumin

Has 2 dead spots @ 180deg apart of about 5deg rotation.

What gets me is, I must have tried that thing a half dozen times or more, after removing and refitting to the frame and every time the armature has landed on those spots every time.

What color is the motor? If the motor is gold colored, then it's an older Genesis motor, manufactured by Bühler, which looks like this:

Those motors are really bad. Athearn has since changed their supplier to Roco, which is a silver colored motor without the gold tint which looks like this:

The Roco motors are a hit or miss, but they're still 10 times better than the older Bühler motors. You probably have a Roco motor as the loco in your photos above has a Roco motor.

If you have an older Bühler motor or need to replace a flaky one, it should be a drop-in for the new motor which is part number ATHG63842 and retails for $39.98. http://www.athearn.com/Products/Defa...odID=ATHG63842

[tootnkumin]

Yes, all the FP45's I've got have the Roco motors. Fortunately Athearn have offered to replace it free, so many thanks to them.

[tootnkumin]

Update......New motor arrived on Friday and got installed on Saturday, put a spot of oil on each bearing first and the same on all driveline points as I did so. Put it on the track and first impression was of how much power I had to apply to get the loco to move (more than either of the sound equipped ones). Don't recall the original (when it did go) needing any where as much and it's speed down the track was also slow.

So, swapped it for the other non sound loco which, at full speed keeps going for 2' before coming to a stop after shutting off the power, whereas the new motor stops dead and when run together (but seperated)the differences become really obvious. Seemed to free up a bit after some running back and forth. I might take it back out and give it some run time on the bench. If it frees up after that, it will throw into question just how NIB the other loco was. If it doesn't, it could be another crook motor.