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Thread: Help Please....design a dbl-deck layout in its own Hand-House shed

  1. #61
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    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by beiland View Post
    Is it possible to include a turnout within the helix track structure, without too much concern?
    I replied to this the other day and it seems to have vanished.

    I can't imagine why there would be any big deal putting a turnout in a helix. People modify curves all the time to accommodate a turnout. Just adjust the roadbed accordingly, or use an appropriate curved turnout.

  2. #62
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    Nov 2009
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    Default Cardboard Mockup

    So I started on some cardboard mock-ups of my lower level subroadbed. I chose to start over in the corner where I wanted to place a turntable scene. I imagine that this will be a full sheet of 3/4 plywood set into that corner of the shed, and have its one inner corner shaved down to meet the narrowing portion the freight yard scene running down that side of the room.

    I cut the cardboard about an 1.5 inches bigger in radius than the 24 inch radius of track (51" diameter) that I expect to place in this region (to give clearance from the backdrops that will be on the walls of the shed, and to give some clearance at the aisle edges.
    (I wanted to maximize the shapes so I could tell if they would be to restrictive to moving around in the overall track plan,...can always make things smaller, but likely no larger).

    I supported this big piece with some very stout steel brackets mounted to the 2x4 studs of the wall (note: backdrop sheets of masonite are not installed yet). I chose these brackets for there large size (16x18), and the fact that they have a 'open area' that will likely be utilized to further support my staging tracks just below that overhead subroadbed of plywood.

    There is a really nice big open area under this cantilevered plywood subroadbed. It is also a very 'deep' lower level shelf to try and reach over to work on any backdrop, and/or upper level scenery. So while I feel the 3/4 inch plywood is strong enough to support the trains, scenery, structures themselves, it would not stand up to any climbing upon by myself. Then I thought, why not just make up removable, repositional, supports for the outer edges of this big deep shelf ( I represent just one such support with that cardboard upright in the photo. I imagine the real ones might just be 2x4 constructions, or perhaps nice big round PVC tubes.

    I am also considering placing a long rectangular flat strips of 3/4" plywood between those metal brackets and the subroadbed sheet. This would lend additional support to the cantilevered subroadbed, as well as provide some clearance for the DCC bus wires attached to the bottom of the subroadbed.
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    Last edited by beiland; 07-18-2017 at 06:50 AM.

  3. #63
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    Default Cardboard Mock-up

    So here are some photos of my 'mock-up'. This was done to get to get some relative ideas of shelf heights, potential shelf depths, aisle needs, support requirements, order of construction, etc, Its kind of surprising the number of new ideas generated, and yet to come upon further study. I would recommend this approach to a new layout design if one has the time.

    Please excuse the number of photos I've included, as it is difficult to capture the 'overall plan' without a wide angle lense, or overhead photo as one sees with the plan drawing.

    Iron Horseman's submitted prelim plan included as a general idea....
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    ...(forget that tool box and stowage shelf in background,...just ran out of places to put the out of the way of the main plan)
    Last edited by beiland; 07-20-2017 at 05:04 PM.

  4. #64
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    more mock-up photos

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    That entrance opening between the two blobs on either side is a good 30 inches,...even with the turntable blob on the right at 52" and the other on the left at 50 inches.

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    Last edited by beiland; 07-20-2017 at 05:10 PM.

  5. #65
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    .....from the inside looking out toward the door.

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    I'm a tall, relatively slim fellow, so I don't need big wide aisles. I find I can get along with a 18 inches neck-down between the peninsular blob and the two blobs at the entrance. Likewise 24 inches seems to be enough for the other 2 aisles. (this layout is for my own consumption,...not for multiple operators, nor visitors).
    I do find i will have to be careful with placing my hands on my waist (elbows extended!) when structures are located close to the edges of the layout.
    Last edited by beiland; 07-20-2017 at 04:50 PM.

  6. #66
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    ...last of the photos

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    I believe I am going to make the upper level 'peninsula area' a relatively narrow abbreviated scene involving some nice logging and mining scenes that can be worked with tight turning small locos that I have a number of. Mountains, trees, trestle bridges, etc,...built of lightweight foam construction and hung from those ceiling rafters rather than requiring any support from below.

  7. #67
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    Can't get much better than that to see how it will all fit (including yourself). Should be able to get ample support off the rafters for the peninsular upper level. Was going to say, you're thinking outside the box, but obviously most will be done inside this time
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  8. Default

    The aisles seem a little bit too tight for me, but that doesn't mean they won't work for you. Years ago, I had a layout with one 24" aisle, and it was OK, but I wouldn't go any tighter. If you're planning to operate solo, then that's different. Have you considered a window for the right side, so people can view the layout, if they can't come inside?

    A slightly different idea, if you're going to double deck the space, anyway, would be to reduce the width of the middle peninsula, by eliminating the 1/2 circle, and turning it into a switching area. That way the aisles could maybe be 1-2" wider, each, as well as the sections along the wall. Not that I always believe it, but as somebody said one time, less is more.

    Have you considered a mushroom or linear helix design, along the 3 walls, behind a removable backdrop?
    Last edited by otiscnj; 07-21-2017 at 05:41 AM.

  9. #69
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    Quote Originally Posted by otiscnj View Post
    The aisles seem a little bit too tight for me, but that doesn't mean they won't work for you. Years ago, I had a layout with one 24" aisle, and it was OK, but I wouldn't go any tighter. If you're planning to operate solo, then that's different. Have you considered a window for the right side, so people can view the layout, if they can't come inside?
    Does NOT show that well in the photos, but the aisle only necks down to 18 inches at the extremes between the center blob and either of those on the sides. It then widens to 24 inches between the peninsula and the shelfs on the sides. This could be widened, but at the moment I don't think it is necessary. With no extensive bench work under this lower level track subroadbed, things seem even more 'open'. As I mentioned before I feel i will only on occasion need extra supports under this lower level shelf, and that will be provided for with 'temporary supports' that will e removable and re-positionable.

    A slightly different idea, if you're going to double deck the space, anyway, would be to reduce the width of the middle peninsula, by eliminating the 1/2 circle, and turning it into a switching area. That way the aisles could maybe be 1-2" wider, each, as well as the sections along the wall. Not that I always believe it, but as somebody said one time, less is more.

    Have you considered a mushroom or linear helix design, along the 3 walls, behind a removable backdrop?
    linear helix....no thank you, mushroom ...no thank you, peninsula...possible narrower at its origin, but definitely still providing the full 48 inch loop at its head.
    Last edited by beiland; 08-04-2017 at 10:37 AM. Reason: clarity, as my original wording was a bit abrupt

  10. #70
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    Well I have some time to reconsider some of my plans as I am currently on a ferry headed to Nova Scotia. A friend who invited me up to his second house in the UNESCO site of Luenberg, NS to escape the heat of FL. I couldn't resist,...a month in cooler weather.

    In am aware that the 24" radius curves don't appear kosher for te big steam articulates, but I if I must comprise the 'appearance' vs the acual capability to negioate those curves wth these modern model articulates, then I may have to op for the 24'inch curves. BTW the nelix will be 30" radius.

    If I remember properly I ran both an Rivarossi Allegheny and a several Broadway articulates on my old Atlas 'Central Midland' layout that had 22" max turns.?

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