Shinohara Curved Turnout 24/22, Code 100


B

beiland

Well-Known Member
Has anyone else seen, or had (have), Shinohara curved turnouts with 24" outer radius and 22" inner radius,...code 100??


I have one right hand one that appears to be that size. I laid a Ribbonrail 24" gauge in the outer curve, and it sure fits well.


I have a potential use for a couple of these,...one left, one right at the moment.
 
I have 2 sizes of the Peco, one very tight, one very broad.

Then I had this 'odd ball' Shinohara which just might work out for me in and certain freight yard situation. So that why I was looking for another one,...plus I wanted to see what other folks might designate this turnout as.
 
You sure of those radius’s, I found a 24" outer and a 20" inner. Do you know the # your looking for?
 
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beiland said:
Has anyone else seen, or had (have), Shinohara curved turnouts with 24" outer radius and 22" inner radius,...code 100??
I have one right hand one that appears to be that size. I laid a Ribbonrail 24" gauge in the outer curve, and it sure fits well.
Click to expand...
Hmmm, No, I don't remember them making a 22"/24" that would be a really long piece of track. Are you certain the inside radius of the one you have is 22" Shinohara catalog shows they have made 24"/20" or 28"/24". And looks like you could get one here:
https://www.harrishobbies.com/track_ho_shinohara.htm

I have never used this vendor. Just found them in a search for this turnout.
 
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Shinohara, code100 Curved Turnout


As I have mentioned above I was incorrect when I first assumed it was a 24/22 turnout.


So first I took my RibbonRail gauge and inserted in the outer rail curve,..












Next I went about determining that inner rail radius, and I tried several different methods..


First laid out over my drawn curves






Second, with a piece of 18" Atlas sectional track laid over the inner radius...



Damn close to 18" inner radius I would say.


So I pronounce the Shinohara as a 24/18, which seems to match their code 83 offerings as well.
 
Shinohara 24/18 vs Peco 22/18, strange

Something rather strange came up when I tried this little experiment. I laid a paper template of the Peco dbl-curve over the Shinohara dbl curve in such a manner as to align their inner radii. Seeing as how the outer radius of the Shinohara is definitely larger than that of the Peco, its strange that it does NOT appear that way in this photo??


 
beiland said:
Something rather strange came up when I tried this little experiment. I laid a paper template of the Peco dbl-curve over the Shinohara dbl curve in such a manner as to align their inner radii. Seeing as how the outer radius of the Shinohara is definitely larger than that of the Peco, its strange that it does NOT appear that way in this photo??
Click to expand...
The difference might be the tiny 'straight' section (see yellow below) on the outside track of the Peco. That makes the "effective" radius longer, even though the "governing" radius is less.

Put a straight edge on the real physical one to verify this.
peco.jpg
 
I think you are correct Iron Horse. I hadn't notice that subtle difference before. Thanks for the illustration.

Just yesterday ....
Walthers lists the ST244 as having
Inside Radius 17-1/4" 43.8cm Outside: 19-7/8" 50.5cm
That Peco outside rail does not appear to be constant radius. Trace 3" at the start of the switch, and compare with the end; it looks to me like it's starting at a broad radius and tightening as it curves. Hence the use of "nominal". But that may be a perspective thing with your camera, not sure.
Blair
Click to expand...

​
As I was fooling around with one of my Peco dbl-curves today I think I discovered that same thing,..it appears to curve a bit more as it diverges.​


And a thought occurred to me, how about cutting some of those ties between the 2 diverging tracks and make them a little less severe curves? Perhaps we could make these turnouts into a true 22/18,.....or even a 23/19 ??
 
Straight Track Section on Peco ST Curved Turnout

A few days ago I had run a little experiment where I had connected some Atlas sectional track pieces to both ends of that Peco curved turnout,....a 22" piece on 2 ends, and an 18" piece on the diverging inner radius. I ran some cars (hand pushed) over this combo to see how well they negotiated it,...all did well.


But I did notice a slight wiggle in the cars as they ran over the 'entrance' to the curved turnout. Now I see why,...that short section of straight track that exist at the entrance.
Peco%20dbl-curve%20with%2018%20and%2022%20extensions%2C%20post%20size.jpg



Peco%20dbl-curve%2C%20flat%20spot%20at%20ponits%20end%281%29.jpg
 
3 Brands Compared


Here are 3 brands of 'small radius' curved turnouts lined up via their frog points, Shinohara 24/18, Roco 22/18, Peco (approx 22/18)


DSCF3175%2C%20Shinohara%2C%20Roco%2C%20Peco.jpg






DSCF3176%2C%203%20curved%20turnouts%201.jpg






DSCF3177%2C%203%20curved%20turnouts%202.jpg



I did notice that the outer rails of the point ends of the Shinohara and the Roco turnouts were curved radius. The Peco rail was a straight line in that area.
 
Peco Mods to be considered

As mentioned by GregC above, what are the guard rails for?
"proper track gauge and gauging of the guard rails guide the wheels thru the frog".


I recently saw these two quotes that I thought needed to be remembered for my Peco turnouts, particularly the 'tight' curved ones that I may end up using.


Derails at the frog of Peco C100 turnouts are often caused by the guard rail being too close to the frog, allowing the wheels to pick the point of the frog. Peco C100 turnouts are for HO & OO size.
The fix is simple: a) make sure the track is in gauge with the NMRA track gauge. b) use the same gauge and the "wheels" notches to be sure of your wheelset spread. c) using the same notches as for the wheels, lay the gauge across the frog and check on the distance to the far side of the guard rail. You will likely see the point of the frog peeking into the notch while the other notch is placed where the back of it's wheel would be against the guard rail. If so, simply glue a 10-thou strip of styrene to the full length of the far side of the guard rail. I use Ambroid "Pro-Weld" for glue.
You'll probably notice that a wheelset that is a bit narrower than standard would never have derailed at that frog, whereas one in proper spec would be nipping at it. I've done this fix to all my Pecos with great success; even my decapod handles them. Try one or 2 switches and decide for yourself.
Click to expand...


Big G, I have found that problem and same solution on my Central Valley #9's. Too much flange clearance between the guardrails and the stock rails allowed the lateral movement into the frog. I lined my guardrails with plastic strip cut from old credit cards and glued in place with ACC "Super Glue" Not one derailment since! Paint the strips to mach the rusty rails when you are sure it works. All in the learning curve, eh? jc5729 John Colley, Port Townsend, WA
Click to expand...
 
beiland said:
Has anyone else seen, or had (have), Shinohara curved turnouts with 24" outer radius and 22" inner radius,...code 100??


I have one right hand one that appears to be that size. I laid a Ribbonrail 24" gauge in the outer curve, and it sure fits well.


I have a potential use for a couple of these,...one left, one right at the moment.
Click to expand...

I have a right hand #6 curved turnout, code 100, Shinohara no. 669-127-E that I don`t need. It has not been used. I bought it at the Toy Train Expo at York this year. I couldn't find any more at my local train store so I changed to Peco that I could also get switch machines.
 
A new use of curved turnouts on my layout !

I guess I am a glutton for punishment 😂, but now I have decided to try and put in another connecting track between 2 sections of curved tracks. Please understand that I think it will assist some switching operations in the long run,....AND I find it challenging to do such track work.

In the past I had made several changes to these two radius tracks connecting the container yard with the turntable and the freight yard ladder,...the 22" and 24" tracks in the upper part of these photos,...
https://forum.mrhmag.com/post/cente...-…-container-terminal-12214324?pid=1331386291

these 2,..
[84248-4]


two curved tracks.jpg

.......the inner one is 22" radius (for diesel engines), and the outer one is 24" radius (for steam engines).

Its going to be a challenge to provide a connection to the two of them, BUT if I can do it, it will provide another way to get empty container cars back over to the freight yard, AND it will provide a way for a switcher engine to do some run-arounds in the container yard.
 
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