Poll: Photo Contests, Your Opinion!

[CBCNSfan]

Do we want the contests to be about the photography or the modeling? I think there are opportunities for one or the other, or both in a given contest,

BINGO! Hit the nail directly on the head. Obviously the contests will have to be primarily about modeling. Topic and allowance leeway would be determined by the contest moderator.
Unfortunately there is no pat answer for the question. The answer will have to come from the membership itself. Truly it's the memberships contest, they'll be the ones submitting the photos, all the admin can do is moderate, see that the accepted guidelines are followed and that fairness is observed, then put enough challenges into the contests to keep it interesting. That is not as simple as it sounds.
For example: There is no way I'd be interested, or that I would take a photograph of something I didn't want to, nor would I post a photo if I didn't like the rules. If enough membership had this same attitude then future contests wouldn't have a very long life.
So that said it then follows that the membership who participate in the contest will be the ones setting the standards that they will have to live with. Forum admin will see that the rules are followed. The rules have to be flexible enough to allow the contest moderator leeway to keep interest peaked.
If this is done right, with acceptable parameters set, the photo contest has the possibility of a very long run on the forums.
One way to establish this is use all the suggestions posted in this thread to help the contest administrator do just that.
So post your likes and dislikes So far there have been a lot of good ideas.
Thank you for your participation

Cheers
Willis

 

[Lester Perry]

Hi Lester,
I was curious about what exactly your referring to when saying, 'Un-retouched'? More specifically what do you consider retouching to be?

This is a model railroad forum. I am sure there are forums for photo shop. Don't get me wrong I love some of the things people do with steam,smoke and dust. But I can't do that as many others probably can't. So if your locomotive can kick up some dust on your layout great take the picture. So some months have it for doctored pics and others for non doctored.

 

[rhoward]

Do we want the contests to be about the photography or the modeling?

I think it is almost impossible to separate the two. A fantastic model in a photograph that is not in focus, taken from a poor angle, and has a bunch of stuff in the photo that has nothing to do with the model (paint cans, tools,.... Lunch... A beer can, etc.) is probably not going to be a winner. On the other hand a poor model even with great photography is still a poor model....

On the issue of "Photoshoping". The usual rules I have seen both at the NMRA (conventions) and other photography contests is more or less as follows. Adjusting the photo for exposure, color balance, cropping, and other things that are normally part of the print process are not considered altering the photo. Adding or removing items (such as smoke, backgrounds, steam, etc.) are considered altering or Retouching the photo and are either not allowed or are placed in a separate class for judging.

BTW Shutterbug magazine has a "Photo Assignment" right now of using some wild lenses to distort or reshape an image....... They will print the best that are sent in.

Just my 2¢

 

[Hoppy]

Well being on the forum only two day probably gets me to the bottom of the opinion poll LOL but no one ever accused me of not speaking my mind.
First off I love seeing the photos, not only the work that is involved in the scenes but the ideas they give me as I work my own layout but to answer your questions for the poll
Some thoughts that I believe are worth discussing
(1) Frequency of contests; weekly; monthly; quarterly or seasonal
This should be left to the mods as they are the folks having to put the work into the contest. quarterly seems like the reasonable answer to me, often enough for folks to keep checking back but not too often that they will get bored with the concept?

(2) The criteria of voting (what are you voting for)
{a} best photography;
{b}closest to contest theme "or"
{c}like myself in the past, just vote for what photo you personally
like best.
I would have to go with C on this one, as there are so many different Themes for model railroading that a theme based contest would be difficult to judge. I like the Steam Era myself, but even my layout is not complete in that era. I am a free style layout guy, where many others are proto type layouts while other still maybe very themed specific such as the circus train from Ringling etc.. So I would have to go with what the individual judges like, based on the work of the scene and the skill of the photography.

Wow I was able to answer that in less the three pages! Amazing for me

 

[Cjcrescent]

I'm not much of a photographer, and don't participate in contests that much. But I do know what I like and do vote accordingly.

Bring the contest back, and if we don't have many participants one month, that's OK as we may get swamped the next month. Besides what's the criteria for keeping them going, a minimum of 5 entries, 10 entries, 25??

 

[CBCNSfan]

On the issue of "Photoshoping". The usual rules I have seen both at the NMRA (conventions) and other photography contests is more or less as follows. Adjusting the photo for exposure, color balance, cropping, and other things that are normally part of the print process are not considered altering the photo. Adding or removing items (such as smoke, backgrounds, steam, etc.) are considered altering or Retouching the photo and are either not allowed or are placed in a separate class for judging.

I think that pretty much covers "Photoshoping", again these allowances to any particular contest would be at the discretion of the contest moderator for any particular contest. The usual prelude to such allowances in a photo contest are preceded by requests from the membership in associated threads. That seemed to be the way it worked in the past.
As far as voting goes, Carey has pretty much said it all for the majority of members who vote "I do know what I like and do vote accordingly."
Myself I consider that most photoshoping does add to quality of the photo but does nothing else for a scene. As said before a poor presentation is just that, and tweaking the photo will do little if anything to improve it.
So the question remains, are we judging the quality of the photo, or the scene, or both combined?
Cheers
Willis

 

[Cjcrescent]

I think that we should be voting on the model as presented in the scene. Not the skills of the photographer, but how the photo fits the current theme. Now yes if the model is poor quality or the photo is of poor quality, out of focus, too dark, too light, etc then you're kinda voting on the photographer. But how would you do that, simply by not voting for that pic, or by commenting on how bad his photo was. I personally believe that if you can't offer a suggestion on how to improve what the modeler is trying to achieve, don't say anything at all.

 

[grande man]

Thanks to everyone for participating in the discussion. Here are a few of my thoughts on the subject...

Photography is an art just like modeling. Photographs are all about visual appeal. A great model railroad photograph is made up of great modeling (a good dslr/lens combo can reveal flaws in a shocking way), great camera work (angles, lighting, composition, settings), and great image editing. Pull one leg of the triangle and you instantly have a mediocre photograph. That doesn't mean that such an image has no value, far from it. Everything in our hobby and photography is a progression. There is a learning curve to everything... We have some amazing modeler/photographers here (think railphotog, Grampy's trains, Selector, etc). I can only speak for myself, but I'd like to continue seeing their fine work in the contests. It is an inspiration.

 

[Selector]

Dare I suggest that we take an integrated, or a holistic approach to the subject of model photography? Two words, neither of which is possible for us to share, and thence to appreciate and evaluate, unless we do both and present both. I can have the best diorama ever displayed in public, but if there are no viewers...............

Similarly, I can be Ansel Adams' grandson, and currently the world's most sought photog (I'm making this up, but humour me...), yet if I submit photos of butt cracks atop beltless jeans,.......

They must be taken together...and therefore, as a person whose professional life revolved around the assessment and selection of people for work assignments, you should have a number of criteria on which to judge each work submitted.

Overall presentation/appeal..."finish", if that works.

Fidelity to the theme.

Quality of the setting viewed. That could include details, completness, fineness in appearance. We might have to break this down into...

Quality of assembly

Details

Weathering

Realism.

And, Photography

If it works and is easily understood, we can assign a weighted value to any of those, or all of them. The list could be shorter or more could be added. But at some point the assessing person would add up the total points, say on a scale from 1-7 or 1-10...would be my suggestion.

We don't need to go running off into the marsh or the swamp here, but a little structure, some written guideliness that might help us all to standardize our contest (goes a long way to smoothing ruffled feathers and hurt feelings, feelings of alienation, etc) will greatly assist the moderator and those who deign to submit examples of their (integrated) accomplishments.

Let's face it, this is an emotional pursuit. We all invest a lot of our personage in this hobby. We all try to put our best foot forward, and depending on one's personality, there really is a lot at stake. So, centralizing it, standardizing it, going to some lengths to make it all acceptable to a wide range of potential participants, will ensure a robust, fair, high quality, and enduring competition...which I understand is our mutual aim.

 

[Mike_Arnold]

Thank's for the offer Mike, I'll have little if any say at all in the selection of the moderator, but I'll assure you that the site administrator who does, is watching this thread.

Mike I hope you realize the amount of work involved in what you are volunteering for, it will take time and dedication on the part of the moderator to keep it organized and running smoothly.

Yes I do. I have vast amounts of free time to take part in an operation such as this.

 

[leghome]

We have had several Photo mods in the past and all have had a goodly amount of work and time involved in running the contests. I have posted a few my photography attempts and enjoyed doing so. It was interesting to see the comments about a few of my photos and most of them were constructive especially when requested. A few negative comments did not deter me from entering again. One man's ideal is another man's pain. The contest always generated interest from all participants and other forum members who just liked to look and see what we had come up with that month for entries. I guess I am done rambling and on to my farm in Farmville. LOL LOL LOL!!!! Bring on the contests I am already thinking about what part of my Model RR I am going to enter int he appropriate place.

 

[CBCNSfan]

Just wondering if that's the total interest in a Photo Contest. The poll will close on 02-05-2011 at 02:33 PM and then I would guess some decision ([yes; no] and who?) will be made. In my honest opinion the poll so far shows enough interest to get one started. So if there is any more to add, now is the time to do it.

Cheers
Willis

 

[rhoward]

Willis,

I do hope they will resurrect the Photo contests. They were always fun! The only reason they stopped was that the gentleman who was doing them couldn't continue due to lack of time.....

In fact the only reason I have hung around here for the last few years has been the WPF thread and the Photo contests!

 

[grande man]

In fact the only reason I have hung around here for the last few years has been the WPF thread and the Photo contests!

I kinda like this place because of the good friends / great atmosphere that contributes to my enjoyment of model railroading... Photo contests are great but they are just icing on the cake.

 

[CBCNSfan]

Willis,

I do hope they will resurrect the Photo contests. They were always fun! The only reason they stopped was that the gentleman who was doing them couldn't continue due to lack of time.....

In fact the only reason I have hung around here for the last few years has been the WPF thread and the Photo contests!

Well I certainly don't have the last say, and not necessarily any say, but I'll go out on a limb to say the contests most likely will be a regular feature. According to the poll there is sufficient interest provided there is a continuing upload of photos each month to be voted on. A moderator will have to be appointed then it will be underway as soon as that moderator is ready.

Like grande man, I've been around long time, well before the first photo contest and for the same reason as him I'm still here. It's certainly the friendliest and best forum I've been on. True there can be a few wrinkles once in awhile, that's because we're humans
(well I think I am )
Cheers
Willis

 

[rhoward]

Like grande man, I've been around long time, well before the first photo contest and for the same reason as him I'm still here. It's certainly the friendliest and best forum I've been on. True there can be a few wrinkles once in awhile, that's because we're humans
(well I think I am )
Cheers
Willis

I assure you I meant nothing derogatory in my statement. Poor choice of words maybe. Most all the folks here are great people and great modelers as well! I would have to say that there are times I have not felt at all welcome in parts of the site do to a few people. A few years ago, this was my favorite forum too. To each their own I guess. I do look forward to certain threads here every week! My best to you sir!

 

[CBCNSfan]

Sorry Ray, no offense taken, I guess I could have used a bit more diplomatic wording. It wasn't directed at you personally, well I guess I was just stating why I like the forum and it didn't come across right. The reasons why a member attends a forum are their own and members reasons can be vastly different from each other. As long as the rules are observed, the reason really doesn't matter. Some teach and some learn and a picture is worth more than a thousand words. Enjoy

Cheers
Willis

 

[Trussrod]

Hi Willis,

I'll also have to say this is a great place with lots of friendly folks and a wealth of knowledge to be shared & gained!

I also enjoy the photo contest and would like to see it continued as it was a way to be creative. One thing I realized should be allowed is to retouch or drop out the background if it is distracting to the subject matter being photographed.

I would also allow the sharpening of digital images as most can benefit from at least a one step sharpening and I would also say that contrast adjustment should also be allowed as it is the basis for sharpening and clarity.

As Eric was saying and you and I know. we have all made a number of friends on the forum and I'm sure we all want to see it prosper and grow which it seems to be doing thank goodness!

My best to everyone this Christmas Season!!

 

[Lester Perry]

http://www.modelrailroadforums.com/forum/showthread.php?t=25491

 

[Iron Horseman]

I think we should "un-sticky" this thread and let it die a natural death.