Walthers says "Just buy a new Shell"?

[RexHea]

Odd to hear all these complaints. I recently built the Walthers Blower House for my steel mill and it had one tiny part of many that was damaged beyond anything I could do and looked like someone stuck their finger through; it was a handrail for the outside stairs. I called and they sent me the one part only in a too large box, fully padded. It took about two weeks. Another time and about five years ago, I had some bad turnouts from their first production of DCC friendly turnouts. They replaced all of them free of charge and even without exchange.
I wouldn't be too quick to judge Walthers from a few isolated cases. They provide us with some very good kits, rolling stock, turnouts, etc. Although I am not foolish enough to buy direct from them and at their MSRP, I have bought and been completely satisfied with several thousand dollars worth of their merchandise. JMHO

 

[diburning]

This is why 99% of my fleet is Atlas. Not only are they smooth runners, but the customer service is top notch. I had a missing sun shade on a Alco C420 call Atlas and the replacement was in the mail free of charge same day, no questions asked.

I was really surprised when Walthers said the only way to get this step was a shell replacement! Brutal.

Atlas used to be like that. I called and told them that my model was missing sunshades. No problem, they sent me new ones along with a free pair of drops steps.

Back in January. I had something similar happen. I called Atlas, and Atlas said they can't do anything unless I send it in! I sent it in along with the case ID number the rep gave me, and my name, address and phone number.

3 months later, no phone call, no email, no model. I called Atlas again, and emailed as well. FINALLY I get a call back. The repairs guy said that they bumped my model up the queue and that they would look at it soon.

Atlas is also pissing people off with their delays with the models. Their CEO posted an apology letter on the site saying Atlas is "back on track" then promptly moved the ship date for the gensets from April to June.

In my opinion, the company has gone into the toilet. If they postpone the gensets again, I will NOT buy any more Atlas products.

Walthers customer service is an oxymoron. They don't provide it. Their products also lack quality (not including the proto series).

For example, their rolling stock. If you measure the wheel tread on the Walthers metal wheels, they are a little wider than code 110. This causes the flanges to catch on some switches, and most diamonds especially if you're crossing in from a curved route. The reason why they put in those wider wheels is to compensate for the fact that their cars are underweight.

The Walthers tank cars are 2 ounces underweight AND have those wide wheels. They also lack the grabs that come standard on Atlas tank cars. The grabs came in a bag and weren't painted.

For the price of a Walthers tank car, I'd expect them to be complete and properly weighted. I shouldn't have to pay $20+ for a car, but fix it like it's an Athearn Blue Box.

Walthers Trainline F40PHs are the most accurate even though the details are all molded on, the drivetrain sucks, and the wheels corrode too easily. Only Walthers makes a correct non-dynamic F40PH. For the one with dynamic brakes, then Kato makes the most accurate model.

 

[MGWSY]

For example, their rolling stock. If you measure the wheel tread on the Walthers metal wheels, they are a little wider than code 110. This causes the flanges to catch on some switches, and most diamonds especially if you're crossing in from a curved route. The reason why they put in those wider wheels is to compensate for the fact that their cars are underweight.

The Walthers tank cars are 2 ounces underweight AND have those wide wheels. They also lack the grabs that come standard on Atlas tank cars. The grabs came in a bag and weren't painted.

For the price of a Walthers tank car, I'd expect them to be complete and properly weighted. I shouldn't have to pay $20+ for a car, but fix it like it's an Athearn Blue Box.

Walthers Trainline F40PHs are the most accurate even though the details are all molded on, the drivetrain sucks, and the wheels corrode too easily. Only Walthers makes a correct non-dynamic F40PH. For the one with dynamic brakes, then Kato makes the most accurate model.

But Walthers saves a lot of money on shipping when your talking thousands of underweight cars being shipped overseas. As for the F40 the Life Like shell is the most correct and Bachmann surprisingly makes the most accurate Amfleets minus the trucks.

 

[CNR Glen]

Quote:
Originally Posted by NWCanuck
Even more so now that I have experienced Walther's Customer Service. I hope my one and only Walther's product has newer worm gears in place.

I can sympathize here, but one must realize that Walther's had to put a limit on replacing these gears somewhere in the process. Otherwise this would haunt then FOREVER considering the number of these units sold.

On the other hand I'm sure they didn't walk into the buyout of Life-Like blind and knew very well the gear problem before the papers were signed. They should honor the warrenty in the same way that Life-Like did in my opinion.

 

[RW&C]

It would be nice for life-like to at least get their web site back up. It's been down since Walthers bought them out in 2005.

 

[diburning]

But Walthers saves a lot of money on shipping when your talking thousands of underweight cars being shipped overseas. As for the F40 the Life Like shell is the most correct and Bachmann surprisingly makes the most accurate Amfleets minus the trucks.

Really? I disregarded life-like because it's a toy.

Making the cars underweight to skimp on costs is exactly what I am getting at. They are cutting corners in their product, and their customer service. And like I said before, if I am paying so much for a car, I expect it to be ready to go out of the box. If I wanted to replace the wheels, install grabs, and add weight, I'd buy an Athearn Blue Box at a third of the cost.

 

[LATX]

But Walthers saves a lot of money on shipping when your talking thousands of underweight cars being shipped overseas. As for the F40 the Life Like shell is the most correct and Bachmann surprisingly makes the most accurate Amfleets minus the trucks.

I will have to agree with that I have both models amfleet 1 coach/cafe from bachmann and a Amfleet 2 Lounge from Walthers. To be honset I love the Bachmann model more. My girlfriend (soon 2 be fiance) bought me "The Continental" train set and it came with 2 coaches and 1 coach/cafe and the DCC F40PH.(To add to my collection of F40's ) but the Bachmann Amfleet has more weight to it and also interior which is lack by Walthers for some odd reason

 

[diburning]

The bachmann amfleets also have interior lighting, as well as all of the paint schemes up to and including Phase IVb.

For those who aren't well versed in Amtrak paint schemes: (this list does not include any of Amtrak's California services)

Phase I - The pointless arrow (sideways letter Y) scheme. Engines have black roofs and red noses. Wide red stripe, narrow white and blue stripes.

Phase II - Phase I without the Pointless Arrow

Phase III - Red, white, and blue strips of equal width

Phase IV - Wide blue stripe, red and white pinstripes

Phase V - Acela (engines)/Lava Lamp (cars) scheme. This is the current scheme for engines. Cars have a wide light blue stripe with seemingly random blotches of color. Amtrak planned to rebrand all Northeast Corridor trains as Acela, but that idea was scrapped. Some electric engines were painted in this scheme with the Acela logo, but the logo was removed and replaced with the new Amtrak flag logo. Besides the Acela Express trains, no in-service engines currently have the Acela logo.

Phase IVb - When the plan to rebrand everything as Acela was scrapped, Phase IVb was adopted. Phase IVb is Phase IV with the new Amtrak flag logo. There are no engines in this scheme, only cars.

The air intake setup appears incorrect on both the walthers and the bachmann, but they were both good attempts.

 

[ICG/SOU]

Atlas is also pissing people off with their delays with the models. Their CEO posted an apology letter on the site saying Atlas is "back on track" then promptly moved the ship date for the gensets from April to June.

In my opinion, the company has gone into the toilet. If they postpone the gensets again, I will NOT buy any more Atlas products.

I was told in my local hobby shop when I asked about the GP38s and GP40s that arrived in country on 22 February but haven't shipped (or shipped in small batches) that what arrived was wrong or damaged or something, in so much as they had to go through the entire shipment and pull out the ones that were still able to be sold. Unfortunately, it looks like only a few folks got their GP38s and GP40s, as now Horizon says June for these engines again.

I am told this problem isn't unique to Atlas, but all companies are suffering from getting bad product from China. Supposedly the Chinese have reorganized a lot of their production (mainly in response to the recession the world is in), and things aren't being made right and there's not much to do about it. Some model companies (not model railroad, but models) have relocated production in the US for their kits as a result. If the model railroad companies do such, then it will come with a price increase, especially if engines and rolling stock of the detail we've grown accustomed to is assembled domestically.

For example, their rolling stock. If you measure the wheel tread on the Walthers metal wheels, they are a little wider than code 110. This causes the flanges to catch on some switches, and most diamonds especially if you're crossing in from a curved route. The reason why they put in those wider wheels is to compensate for the fact that their cars are underweight.

The Walthers tank cars are 2 ounces underweight AND have those wide wheels. They also lack the grabs that come standard on Atlas tank cars. The grabs came in a bag and weren't painted.

For the price of a Walthers tank car, I'd expect them to be complete and properly weighted. I shouldn't have to pay $20+ for a car, but fix it like it's an Athearn Blue Box.

I know that most folks here enjoy putting all their rolling stock and locomotives together, but I feel no more enjoyment or ownership of a kit, an RTR that needs a couple of things put on, or a fully detailed and assembled model. The money I paid is my ownership. However, when I pay more than $20 and I have to put something on (and find a paint to match as well as drill the holes), it annoys me a little. In a recent survey I took of Walthers, I told them I'd be willing to pay up to $3 more per car if it was completely assembled. I figured it would be cheaper than the $4 a bottle of paint I pay for to paint the grabs and other fine details and the $4 per pair of #80 drill bits that I break making the holes for, as well as frustration.

I have noticed, though, that some of the Gold Line stuff is starting to come completely assembled. That's a step in the right direction, in my opinion.

Walthers Trainline F40PHs are the most accurate even though the details are all molded on, the drivetrain sucks, and the wheels corrode too easily. Only Walthers makes a correct non-dynamic F40PH. For the one with dynamic brakes, then Kato makes the most accurate model.

I'm still new at this, but I've been comparing GP9s, and it seems that the GP9 that Trainline uses is the same as the GP9 Bachmann or Lifelike or Model Power have used too. Is such the case as well?

 

[diburning]

I'm pretty sure that the Trainline GP9 is a Walthers creation (with handrails that are too short in height) and a P2K motor since Walthers bought out P2K.

Yes. However, some of the Gold line cars are in paint schemes with colors impossible to match without paint mixing.

I enjoy building kits as well as buying RTR cars. What I don't like is buying a RTR car that needs almost as much work as a kit, with the RTR price. If you factor in the cost of wheels, and the cost of weights, and cost of paint to paint the grabs, it's much cheaper, and less work to buy an Atlas or Athearn car. I didn't even fator in the time it takes.

Athearn seems to be scrapping their Genesis line of cars. I bought a bunch of RTR cars cheap (Walthers had them on sale for half price) and they were simply Genesis cars without coupler cut levels, air hoses, and the Genesis trucks. The walkways are all etched metal, the grabs are all metal and painted. They kept the Genesis brake rigging on. I bought an Athearn RTR tank car which is one of these dumbed down Genesis cars and I thought it was the best tank car I've ever bought (it was also the least expensive at $13.49) with etched metal details that are even better than Atlas. The car had correct weight, free-rolling metal wheels, and decent plastic couplers (that I threw out and replaced with Kadee scale head shelf couplers)

 

[ICG/SOU]

Yeah, the SIECO boxcars that Athearn has out are from the Genesis line, but with some fewer details as you stated.

I buy Walthers sometimes because they are the only ones who've seemed to make models of prototypes or roads I want that no one else seems to make. No one out there makes a centerbeam flat (until Atlas just came out with one), a SIECO pulpwood car, a Greenville woodchip hopper, a two bay Greenville aggregate hopper, and a few other assorted cars. ICG, SOU, GM&O, IC (post ICG era), and some NS don't seem to be represented by Atlas, Athearn or others as much as Walthers. Most of the product I see is geared towards current roadnames with established cars (Athearn does two or three FMC and PS boxcar models for boxcars and that's it, unless it's a high cube, Atlas has a little more variety, but makes smaller runs so it's a few years before they get to the same model again, unless you're talking about the Trainman line).

The tank cars that Athearn is putting out now are very nice. I noticed several months ago that the wheelsets on them are all metal (including the axles). They lack the air hoses and uncoupling levers that Atlas cars usually have, but the paint and the placards are very crisp and clear.

The couplers do have to be replaced, though, since the plastic is too flexible and will break with a heavy train on grade.

 

[NWCanuck]

Just some fuel for the fire, I received 3 Airslide 50' hoppers the other day from MB Klein. They retailed for $21.98 USD and I got them $17.98. I got a single car which was a "Rock Island" and a two car pack "Great Northern", but the real deals were the 2893 Hoppers from $27.98 down to just $9.99 of which I got 4 total. These are all Walthers Goldline brand cars and I have no problem with the 2893 hoppers, they retail for $35.99 CDN from my LHS which is retail plus markup. You can see why I buy US.

The problem was with the Airslides from Walthers. The "Great Northern" 2 pack retails for $39.99 USD and the single "Rock Island" goes for $21.98. I get them home and take the Rock Island car out of the package holding it by the sides near the top edge to prevent finger prints (just a habit to prevent damaging details which these cars don’t really posses). And what happens... the bottom falls of including the weight and trucks.

Are you kidding me? Are these RTR or Almost Ready to Roll? Lucky for me I was holding it 4 inches off of the table when this happened. Okay so 1 car was missed during the gluing process. I opened the 2 pack of Great Northern’s, same thing, bottoms fall out (I was ready this time of course).

I know these are not Proto 2000 but for the prices involved here and the prices we pay for the Ready to Roll privilege this is unacceptable as far as I am concern. Walthers... you are on a downward spiral, I will take my hard earned dollars else ware if this is the future of your quality control!


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The thin cross member dead center of this photo on all three cars was the only spot a pathetic attempt was made to apply any glue.

 

[ICG/SOU]

Yeah, the Airslides I have weren't really glued on the bottom, which was ok with me, since I had to fix the weight in one of them and fix another because it was glued on crooked.

 

[NWCanuck]

I just got off of the phone with Walthers again today. This time I called and told them that I just recieved a locomotive that was missing a detail part (the step). The gentleman on the phone took down my information and informed me that he would send me a relacement in the mail.

I guess there is something to be said for the way you word a conversation. Anyway there may still be some customer service left over there at Walthers and maybe the guy I origionally talked to was just having a bad day? Never the less a step is in the mail and on its way to me....

 

[flatlander]

Response to post

I am a fairly new dealer for Walther's when I opened up my New store in December. I am concerned so I called Walther's and told one of the managers that this post was here and there are numerous customers who are not happy with Walther's. They told me yesterday they were going to read the post and see what can be done. I do not know if it will help but have tried

 

[LATX]

I am a fairly new dealer for Walther's when I opened up my New store in December. I am concerned so I called Walther's and told one of the managers that this post was here and there are numerous customers who are not happy with Walther's. They told me yesterday they were going to read the post and see what can be done. I do not know if it will help but have tried

Thanks to be honset. More manfucters should be on forums like these. I know on other "paid" forums come detail companies be on them lol

 

[diburning]

I am a fairly new dealer for Walther's when I opened up my New store in December. I am concerned so I called Walther's and told one of the managers that this post was here and there are numerous customers who are not happy with Walther's. They told me yesterday they were going to read the post and see what can be done. I do not know if it will help but have tried

We're not the only forum with people unhappy with walthers. If you google walthers and split gear, or Walthers and customer service, you'll see many forums with many people unhappy with walthers.

I don't buy walthers cars (for myself) anymore. I will buy Proto 2000 locomotives only if they make a prototype no one else is making. Walthers has also started doing the ignorant thing of regearing all new runs of Proto 2000 locomotives so that they would run at a "prototypical" speed, which makes the engines impossible to run together. When Life-Like made Proto 2000, they only used one gear ratio at a time (but changed it over time)

There is an unofficial standard gearing for HO scale locomotives that manufacturers like Athearn, Atlas, Intermountain, etc use so that the consumer won't have (too many) problems running engines from different manufacturers together.

With Walthers putting different gear ratios into different locomotives in the Proto 2000 line based on what they think the gear ratio should be, you wouldn't be able to run 2 Proto 2000 locomotives of different models together easily. Also by putting the different gear ratios into different models, they are driving the costs of production up, which is then passed on to the consumer.

 

[LotoQuestions]

Is this why they were on sale??

Walthers HO Platinum line 30' Wood caboose CNR

I just received one today and find that the truck sideframes & wheels interfere with the corner of the steps unless on straightaway. All 4 corners present problems. I estimate that they should be good for about 100" radius track

Just checked another and it is the same way.............

May be possible to shim slightly or as a last resort redrilling the truck mount by a sixteenth or trimming the step frame ....

And these are regular 40$ US.

,,, Ken

 

[Charles Smiley]

Walthers Platinum caboose

I just bought two SP wood hacks from Walthers. Both had very stiff couplers with the screws mashed down. Both had trucks that popped apart. I replace all trucks and couplers as a habit anyhow.

But it's stuff like this that will discourage new hobbyists and hurt Walthers and us in the long run.

These were normally $39, and on sale for $16. So I think I got my money's worth here. They do look nice and they really made a good effort to model a specific caboose.

I'd say that with all the RTR cars I've bought nearly all suffer with stiff couplers or ones that droop so much that they catch in turnout frogs and the like. This isn't just a Walthers problem.

 

[Charles Smiley]

Cracked gears

I have a friend that both a bushel-basket full of LL P2K locos in SP colors. It was at a train show in Ventura County or Santa Barbara (not sure). The seller was some wealthy guy that claimed he was leaving the hobby. Every one of the locos had cracked gears. Some had all four axles cracked and all made terrible noises or wouldn't move from gear-bind. Nice guy eh?

I bought four from my friend and fixed them by tearing up old Athearn locos for the repair parts. The axle gears had to be cut to the right length first.

They run very well now. But the real story is that the original owner ran them into the ground and re-packed them in their boxes and sold them as new-old-stock.

The old LifeLike gear trucks (GP9s) look like someone copied the Athearn design BTW. But as usual (Made in China) I think they used a cheaper substitute plastic. I never saw a cracked gear on an Athearn diesel so they must use a better grade.