Tinplate or Hi-rail? Yes!

[Guy64]

The C+D "S"ystem is a modular S gauge (1/64 scale) layout currently of 14 sections. [As of July 2008, there are 16 sections.] Some areas are geared for a tinplate setting, with American Flyer track in rubber roadbed, cloth scenery, operating accessories, and buildings of either sheet metal or wood/hardboard designed after Minicraft buildings. Other areas are laid with ballasted Gargraves track, more realistic scenery, and eventually, weathered buildings and equipment. Everything in between these extremes is subject to inclusion, if it's the right size. Toy vehicles and buildings of "antique" or current manufacture are used.

Railroad equipment includes classic Gilbert American Flyer, and especially new equipment currently offered by American Models, S Helper Service, and many other makers of S scale products.

In early 1998 the system looked like this...

[Lady_Railfan]

Yay!!! I feel so much better now, knowing you're back! The newcomers who missed your earlier posts are in for a real treat. Thanks for posting. :)

[Guy64]

Further east on the line (still 1998) we come to Calvary Chapel of Tinplate County. The layout was taken down after this 10 week run at a local mall, and the church building and parking lot were moved to the other side of the street on the right. In this place is an original AF "baggage smasher" station, with a few Plasticville buildings along the back edge.

[modelbob]

Chuck,

We recently ran a special train for S scalers. They had a regional convention in Tacoma, WA just after the NMRA national convention. They chartered the MRSR, and seemed to really enjoy the ride. I went to their swap meet and enjoyed seeing the stuff for sale. I didn't buy much of anything, but only since I'd spent way too much the week before at the National Train show and on the NMRA convention.

They had some nice layouts on display too, including both scale and hi-rail.

[Guy64]

Bob...

Was than an NASG convention? I didn't know you hung out with S scalers so much! :D

[Guy64]

This was the church area in August of 2000. As seen, the concrete road (now weathered) is to the left of the building and the parking lot is bigger. Also, the Gargraves track has been ballasted.

[modelbob]

Bob...

Was than an NASG convention? I didn't know you hung out with S scalers so much! :D
Yes, it was a regional convention of the NASG. I think they were hoping to get some of the NMRA folks, but the crowds were not as llarge as they hoped.

I don't normally attend the NASG stuff, or any other model railroad conventions for that matter, I just don't have the time.

A couple of years ago we had Dody Stevens on staff here and she and her husband were really involved in S scale. I think he was NASG president or something. She was active with the forum for quite a while but when we moved to the new site and our own domain she looked at it one time and never came back. I have no idea why...

[Greg Elems]

Chuck,
Nice to see your pictures again. That track looks good with the ballast. Looks like you are using Gargraves track. How do you keep the ends from getting bent out of shape? That was one problem I had on a modular layout I worked on in the late 80's.

Greg

[Guy64]

Bob...

Now that you mention her I do remember Dody. Too bad she doesn't post here, it's even better than the old site. You suppose she became a "lurker"?


Greg...

Our modules are constructed to unusual specs. (As far as I know, ours is the only layout using them.) Track goes right up to the ends of each section (no bridge tracks), but the configuration of the ends is such that track pins are protected. It works very well, but we haven't been able to take the system to enough locations to get a feel for long term durability.

I'll hafta take a pic showing how these things fit together.

[Guy64]

The former location of the church...

Shops line the back street across from the AF "Baggage Smasher" station. The station building has a tendency to "walk" due to the vibrating mechanism that moves Billy the Bag Smasher, so the whole accessory is set in a recessed "pocket" formed by platform extensions. Still much work remains, such as street light wiring, more weathering, and more people. There're never enough people.

Next time, I might also put the station roof on straight.

[Greg Elems]

Those streets with the tar repair lines look fantastic Chuck. I would't have noticed that the station roof was crooked if you hadn't said anything. :D

I like to see a shot of your module edges and how they fit together.

Greg

[modelbob]

Look at all those cars everywhere, man that's a lot of traffic, and it's not getting anywhere very fast between the trains and dogs and fire trucks and wrecks....

Hey, a scale model of Seattle traffic on a typical Friday night!

[Guy64]

Greg...

I'll try to get a pic of typical module ends asap. Hopefully, it won't take as long as it did to get a pic of that caboose you wanted to see last year. :rolleyes:

Bob...

Yeah, living in SoCal we've kinda gotten accustomed to dense traffic. Yesterday I worked about 40 miles from our residence, and the ride time home was doubled because of a motorcycle accident on the freeway. Then, there was a 2nd fender-bender caused by the traffic jam of the first accident...Argh. Still, the traffic on the C+D looks a bit odd without the associated crowds that should be there. Cars look strangely abandoned.

[Greg Elems]

Thanks Chuck, I look forward to see the end of the module pictures. Also, could you repost that caboose picture. I will save it this time. ;)

Greg

[Guy64]

A broad view of the same area...

That's my wife Diana, taking a break from cattle wrangling to coach a gate operator (out of frame, left) at the 2000 TTOS national convention on G deck of the Queen Mary. It's so dark because we were assigned this unlit spot under a stairway. The background shows the normal lighting.

[Guy64]

Our tour continues "eastbound" ...

What's the quickest scenery to make when a show date looms ahead? Asphalt! Concrete! So that's what was applied to the newest Gargraves section just before August 2000.

This is "Snappy Al's Used Cars", a parking lot that gives our friend Jim a chance to display a small portion of his diecast vehicle collection. A few of ours have been smuggled in as well, including Di's "Lady Bug", a Hot Wheels VW that I repainted.

[Lady_Railfan]

PLEASE let us know when (and where) you do another show. I'd love to see your layout in person!

[Guy64]

Oh, how we'd LOVE to set up the layout somewhere, in a clean place, with good security, where lots of people could come for...oh, say 3 months... ;)

When we first began building the thing, mall shows and such were frequent. Now, the malls prefer to clutter their open spaces with kiosks, which I assume pay rent. The draw of train layouts doesn't count for much, I guess.

But, when the C+D System does a show or whatever, you'll hear about it here.

East of Snappy Al's we come to Jim's Mobilgas, built by the same Jim whose cars fill the car lot. I thought Jim would cover the whole corner for the gas station, so I didn't paint it with "asphalt". Oops.

Jim likes to inject subtle bits of "irony" into his scenes. Note the blue lowrider bouncing on its left side, with the police right behind. Also, the 18 wheel flatbed truck with a single pallet load...

[Greg Elems]

I see that cool caboose rounding the corner Chuck. ;) Sure nice to see the layout again.

Cheers,
Greg

[Guy64]

Oh, yeah, sorry Greg. Here it is...

From the Christmas layout pix. Guess I gotta reload those, too. :o

[Greg Elems]

Thanks Chuck! I don't know why, but that caboose really strikes my fancy. Did you use SHS caboose trucks under it?

Greg

[Guy64]

No Greg, those are AM caboose trucks. SHS rb caboose trucks weren't around when that caboose was done.

I'll probably get around to ordering at least one pair of SHS trucks, tho. The AM bay window caboose that gave up those trucks will need modern replacements. :cool:

[Greg Elems]

Well that AM bay window gave its trucks for a good cause. Also, SHS is real good about selling trucks separately.

Greg

[Guy64]

Oh yeah! I've already got several pairs of freight roller bearing trucks from SHS, some of which ended up on Lionel triple deck auto racks. SHS is good about so many things, aren't they? (Except about making a truly modern locomotive! ;) Oh well, you can't have everything, I guess. :o )

Moving along, we come to the "backside" of the city, which I haven't figured out a name for, yet. The buildings are mostly "Girder and Panel" building sets of assorted vintage, from 1960 to 1996. Obviously, much work remains here. Looks like Jim shoulda brought more cars, too.

[Guy64]

The other side of town...

The oldest Girder and Panel building we have is the orange and yellow "Corbu-ish" office structure, built from a 1960 #8 set. It's the only building made from the instruction book. All the others are original designs. The twin towers nestled in the horseshoe curve are from a 1977 set. They are not patterned after the World Trade Center (unlike the WTC they're one building), but after the Arco building in downtown Los Angeles. Nevertheless, somtimes folks do think of Manhattan when they look at this area. Once an elderly lady asked me, "Is that supposta be Noo YAWK?" I got the feeling she wasn't impressed.

The slim, very rectangular building near the center is from a 1975 set, inspired by the Seagram building which IS in NYC. The tall silver tower with the vertical blue window array has no prototypical inspiration, nor does the low, roughly triangular building in the previous view. Both of these last two were built from 1990s sets. At the right, also from a 1990s set, is the postmodern building with the peaked roof. It was built by Jim, who prefers to expose the "granite" (reverse) sides of the 1990s wall panels.

Miscellaneous leftover land parcels were "developed" with Hot Wheels and Matchbox buildings (we like to be current) and a prewar Marx Grand Central Station (we also like to be nostalgic.)

[Guy64]

Due to our odd location at the 2000 TTOS convention, it was hard to get good camera angles on certain areas. To get a better look at the industrial module, we'll step back to 1998, when the system was set up at a local mall.

The city was much smaller, the layout being four feet shorter overall. The industrial module begins at the right of this view.

The warehouse-like structure partially shown at the right is a distribution center for National Frammuss and Muffler Bearing, Inc. Actually, it's a false front made of wood and hardboard that hides AF controls and provides a setting for the AF loading platform. The building was intended to project a "Minicraft-ish" look, but I couldn't bring myself to make things quite so... uh, uneven. :rolleyes:

Yeah, I know. It's a blessing.

And a curse.

[Guy64]

Looking the opposite way, into the industrial module.

The Marx Grand Central Station at the left is one of Di's favorite accessories. Lithographed sheet metal does have a great deal of charm, and I certainly can't complain about the "free" people included in the artwork.

The Amtrak train is an American Models set done in the mid '90s. It came out just as the GM F40-PH was being retired by Amtrak. I'm still waiting for AM (or somebody) to do the F59-PHI. It could use the same chassis as the loco in this pic! Waddayasay, AM? :D

[modelbob]

I remember those girder and panel sets well. I had one as a kid, we got it second hand and boy did I ever play with it. The panels were pretty fragile, and most of them were already gone by the time we got the set anyway, so most of my structures didn't have walls, but I sure had lots of fun building bridges and building and who knows what.

[Guy64]

Bob...

I also had a couple of G+P sets as a kid. Weren't they a blast? You're right, the panels in the '58-'63 sets were quite delicate. Sometime in the '70s (I think), Kenner changed the panel material to a much tougher plastic. Unfortunately, they also ceased to emboss them, so they didn't always lay flat. The orange panelled building was built from the #8 set of 1960, though it uses none of the powered features. The blue buildings are made from '70s Kenner sets with the tougher panels. The silver buildings are built from Irwin sets of the '90s.

I also have a Skyrail set from '63, but it hasn't been integrated to the system yet. That will probably entail building another pair of straight sections.

[Guy64]

Not to cause whiplash, but this angle reveals a more complete view of the National Frammuss building (at right.) Though a false front, it does have some depth, (about 5" worth), and includes a loading dock. Each roll-up door has a light recessed into the roof above it. A couple people have commented that the doors are "too big for S", but they're actually 13x12 S scale feet. Oversized, yes, but big things are stored here. Muffler bearings can be quite large!

[Greg Elems]

Chuck,
Nice pictures, and I'm enjoying the history behind the buildings. Looking forward to your next post.

Greg

[Guy64]

Back to our eastward trek...

At the East end of the yard is another false front, this chemical research facility. Nobody knows just what kind of research is done here, but it calls for frequent spotting of tankcars and gondolas, as well as regular loading of barrels. Louie the Loader tends to the barrels.

The Gilbert AF Oil Drum Loader is a crowd favorite, and amazingly reliable. Even if a delinquent barrel jams up Louie's fork lift, forcing him to "park" in one spot for an hour with the power on, the induction motor takes the abuse in stride. Repairs have never been needed.

Since the building was meant to set off the accessory, it was painted the same colors: yellow with brown accents, a green roof. The foundation matches that odd "tan" (or whatever it is) color which I think Gilbert meant to depict concrete. One evening, while I was painting the green on the roof, working in the dim light of the garage, I had one of those "flashbacks." Not a drug flashback, a hobby/model/toy train/gee-this-is-fun flashback. It was as if I was back in 1960, just as content as can be, not a care in the world. Nothing I ever did with my trains when I was a kid was anything close to this elaborate, so I know it wasn't a recalled memory. Kinda weird, but relaxing.

I guess that's what hobbies are for, relaxation.

[Guy64]

Back to 2000...

This "helicopter view" shows how different the industrial area looks after "paving in" the yards. Much easier for trucks, forklifts and such to navigate... and collide with a locomotive! :eek: Guess I better put down some caution stripes.

It was always intended that at least one more section be added between these two. The whole module would be much more useful. Just need to get a round tuit.

[Guy64]

In post #32, the mainline running East in front of the chemical research building connects the industrial zone with the "desert", which in 1998 covered a single corner section. For 2000, the desert grew an additional straight section inserted beween the yard area and the corner. Featured on the new section is a reproduced AF "Track Gang" accessory. The all metal device includes four crewmen, two of which jitter constantly at trackside as if operating hand-held ballast tampers. Another stands further from the track with a caution signal, and the fourth "tends" to the compressor cart. When a train approaches, the two tampermen stop shaking and move away from the track, while the signalman rotates in a 90 degree arc, showing the signal to the engineer. The compressor guy just stands there. He must be the lead man on the gang. (Actually, he's the on/off switch.) After the train passes, everybody scoots back to their normal positions and the "work" resumes. All this is controlled by two relays actuated with AF pressure trips attached to the outer main.

I neglected to get a decent snap of it, but it is hoped this upsampled pic will be regarded as better than nothing. :o The track Gang is to the left, set in the green area next to the outer main. The yellow patch in the midst of the green is the end of the compressor. Squinting may be necessary to make out the crew. Sorry.

[Guy64]

A clearer view of the desert corner...

This is the only corner in the system which uses AF track. (Although the wide radius curve sections are K-Line.) All the other corners use Gargraves flextrack. It is hoped that someday all Gargraves track on the C+D will be replaced by a newer brand using solid rail. It is also hoped that someday I will make up my mind which brand to use. :confused: (Note: The decision was made in 2006. American S Gauge track is replacing the Gargraves in 2008.)

Nothing to look at but sand, cactus, tumbleweeds, oil wells and railroad. It works for me!

[Guy64]

The Farm Module (west end) in 2000.

All sections on the C+D which are laid with AF track are theoretically designated "tinplate" areas. Structures are usually made of sheet metal, or at least possess a "toyish" appeal. Operating accessories are more likely to be found in these zones, as is lithography. Scenery often consists of plastic "two dimensional" trees and cloth ground cover, and everything is generally "clean."

Areas with Gargraves track are designated "hi-rail", and are intended to be more realistic. Buildings and roads are weathered, Detail is deeper and more correct, proportions are more accurate. Scenery (what is finished anyway, which isn't much) is more realistic.

In practice, these two approaches turned out to be somewhat difficult to segregate, as is apparent with "Bossy's Farm", a three section module which straddles both concepts. The west end seen here is blatant tinplate, featuring more operating accessories than any other section built so far. A turnout, crossing signals, stockyard, and milk canister unloading platform each contribute to the action here. A very popular accessory is Bossy the Bovine, an oversize cow that jumps into the outer main at the worst times, forcing any approaching train to stop. The trains are supposed to stop in time to avoid hitting Bossy, which they usually do with unprototypical success. To get the train running again, visitors are invited to push a button, which makes Bossy leap from the track, allowing the train to "mooove on." It does so, automatically. Lotsa action for the push of one button!


At the corner (right), track changes abruptly to Gargraves, and continues as such for many scale miles eastward. Still, toy structures continue to show up as we move east, though they are more realistic structures with accurate proportions (the barn is HUGE), and scenery features yield gradually to greater realism.

But here, near her pasture, Bossy rules. Already she's blocking the eastbound main...

[Guy64]

For a better view of Bossy, we must return to 1998...

The polyethylene cow is about 8 scale feet tall at her shoulders, much too big for a normal cow. I have often considered replacing her with a 1/64 Ertl Holstein. Two things have prevented the change: First, as she is, Bossy is an excellent gauge to measure the philosophy of adult visitors. Are they a rivet-counting scaler or a who-cares tinplater? A scaler will usually make their awareness of the scale discrepancy known immediately. "Hey! That cow's WAY too big!" A tinplater will usually just smile and watch their kid's reaction.

Secondly, my wife won't hear of it! :o

Since both strains (scaler/tinplater) run through me, I avoid any crippling internal crisis by reconciling the anomaly with this stipulation: Bossy is a 1/64 scale giant 8 foot tall cow, the tragic result of hormone experiments gone wrong. This explains her excess bulk as well as her suicidal tendency to jump (and I do mean JUMP) in front of moving trains. It also explains the unusually high success rate at which engineers stop in time. That chunk of beef could derail anything!

Any visitor dropping their jaw upon hearing this explanation is confirmed as a "hopeless rivet counter."

Here she is, doing her best to upset the C+D schedule. Farmer Wendell ponders the situation from the front porch of SP 432.

[CBCNSfan]

Hm! Looks like Bossy is showing them who's boss, nice pictures. I've been following along as you post them Great stuff, hope there's more to come.
__Willis___CB&CNSfan

[Guy64]

Thanks Willis, glad these are enjoyed.

The Cow on Track is a very popular accessory, especially with kids. They sometimes get so excited that shoving matches have occurred in the line to push Bossy's button. (And some say kids don't like trains.)

There is also an interesting spectrum of approaches to "Bossy operating." So far I've been able to identify five distinct patterns:


1. Worry-Wart

This type seems anxious to avoid any possibility of a mishap. If Bossy is over the rails, they will push the button immediately to get her out of the way, even if a train is nowhere close. "Forget FUN, the line must be cleared! NOW!!" The worry-wart can cause much frustration among the other types, who want to see the whole show.


2. By-the-Book

This type is a stickler for procedure. They want all the boxes checked. The sign asks, "Is Bossy blocking the train?" If there is no train stopped on the scene, Bossy is not blocking the train. Therefore the button should not be pushed. Not until Bossy is actually blocking a train should the button be pushed. It's only official procedure, after all. Bossy stands on the track, a train approaches, it stops. THEN the button is pushed. Bossy hops from the track, the train continues on its way, as specified. No problems, no incident reports, no extra paperwork.


3. Skeptic

Like type 2, the skeptic will wait for the planned events to play out. The difference is motivation. Whereas #2 just wants things to go according to plan, #3 wants to verify system integrity. They wish to see if the train REALLY stops in time, and if it does, who's REALLY in control. "I'll bet that guy stopped it!" The skeptic will often demand that my wife and I have both our hands in plain view before they will push Bossy's button. Sometimes they're still not convinced. "Hmmph! I don't know..."


4. Thrill Seeker

The thrill seeker will watch for all events to play out, waiting eagerly to see if the train stops in time to miss Bossy. However, they are visibly disappointed when it actually does. Bored with routine, #4 wants events, incidents, "hard news" and such. Their faces will beam with transcendent joy if the throttle is set a bit too high and the train coasts into the cow, shoving her aside. It doesn't matter to them that they've missed their chance to shoo Bossy away and restart the train at the mere push of a button, they've seen what you don't see every day: Bossy getting diced.


5. Meat-Grinding Thrill Seeker

Closely related to #4, #5 also allows events to occur as per routine, but #5 is sneaky! After pushing the button to restart the train, they will keep their finger in touch with the button, wait for the locomotive to pass Bossy, then lean on the button again in hopes of making the poor cow lunge into the moving consist before the train can clear. Disappointment is inevitable. #5 is the reason that only the "jump off" button is accessible to visitors. The "jump on" button is hidden where only a layout operator can get to it.


While it is doubtful that any "pure" specimens of the types above exist, here we see what could be a classic #2:

The train stopped, the button was pushed on cue, Bossy jumped away and the train resumes its journey with hardly a minute lost. Case study #2 (in Santa Fe T shirt) basks in the wake of a job well done, while absorbing a well-earned "Atta-Boy!" from Mom...

[CBCNSfan]

http://pages.prodigy.net/bestsmileys1/signs/Funny_post.gif AND a http://pages.prodigy.net/bestsmileys1/signs/goodpost.gif
That is quite a set up, funny what emotions you can observe when you you give the curious a button to press, and my hat's off to those who go to the trouble of generating intrest for the young. I vividly remember one train show, where on the point of a well detailed and weathered consist of locos and cars there was this horribly painted silver colored F7, and I was thinking who did that and what were they trying to prove. Well the answer wasn't far away, there he was, a little guy about 6 or 7, beaming from ear to ear because his precious loco was at the head of the train, and at that point I knew why. Thats a great photo above, keep them coming if you have more.
Cheers Willis

[Guy64]

On the other hand, here we have a subject from 1998 that, judging from his grip on Bossy's button, could be harboring a marked type 5 streak... :eek:

[CBCNSfan]

http://pages.prodigy.net/bestsmileys1/signs/goodpost.gif http://pages.prodigy.net/bestsmileys1/signs/Funny_post.gifhttp://pages.prodigy.net/indianahawkeye/newpage26/2.gif

[Lady_Railfan]

Chuck, thanks so much for bringing these back to us! Your posts were among our greatest losses when the forums went down, and I'm so glad you're willing to take the time to share them again. Your posts are the high point of my day. :)

[Guy64]

Many thanx to all for the kind words. Claudia, you need to get out more! :D ;)

Naw, I'm jess teezn'.

At last we come full circle, to the west end of the farm...

Much work remains to be done here, the green felt is just temporary "grass". This site awaits a realistic ground cover treatment, the buildings need paint and weathering, detailing, and of course, more people. These Ertl structures are without Plasticville "shrinkage", being made to full 1/64 proportions. They may be moved to the foreground, eventually.

[Guy64]

During the long run in 1998, I would occasionally have time to prowl the room to get candid people shots. I tried to catch this little guy, "deeeeep in ze plachtau" while bouncing the gates up and down. He caught me in time to flash a practiced grin. I had the feeling he gets many photo ops.

[Lady_Railfan]

Claudia, you need to get out more! You may be right about that, but why bother when I can have so much fun right here! :D

[CBCNSfan]

Well some of it looks a little blurred, but that smiling face is all it needs, makes it worth while don't it.
Cheers Willis

[Guy64]

Sometimes things aren't all grins. This gate operator seemed to think that Billy the Bag Smasher (out of view) might respond to a pep talk:

"I'm pushing the button! So MOVE already!!"

[CBCNSfan]

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/0903/nibbs/7bdaf59b.gif it must be a riot observing the young ones with the button, hope you have more

[Guy64]

Grins were not to be seen here, either. The boy on the right apparently was hypnotized by the oil derricks. Dunno if it was the bubbling yellow "oil", or the red glow. I doubt it was the bubbling sound, since none of that could be heard above the general din.

The boy on the left seemed very unhappy. Was he just tired, or did one of his parents say, "No, we don't have room for trains..."?

[CBCNSfan]

Hj Chuck, well the way I see it is the boys are very interested and intently focused on something out of the photo, That I can understand, because from the photos so far there is a lot to take in, I mean watching that layout in operation would push Disneyland right out of their minds and I'd bet they would be talking about it for years after. BUT! I do like the captions, keep em coming :D

[Guy64]

These two girls were both very concerned with gate operation, but the girl on the left couldn't help wondering about the dog caught in traffic...

[Guy64]

Of couse, kids weren't the only people visiting the QM that day. Here, our diecast-collecting friend Jim (rt) discusses the natural interface of 1/64 car collecting with 1/64 model railroading...

[Guy64]

From 1998...

An American Models intermodal consist traces the edge of the city...

[Guy64]

Still 1998, still intermodal, my first scratchbuilding effort (finished March '94), a "steel" welded flat carrying an unprototypic load...

[Guy64]

Yours truly (left) and Jim take a deep breath before dragging another helping of the C+D System into a freight elevator aboard the Queen Mary.

Getting to our venue on G deck, 20 feet below the waterline, was... um, interesting. We had to first load as much of the layout as we could handle per trip into a freight elevator, which changed its altitude by 4ft. We were not allowed to accompany our equipment on this epic vertical journey, but had to take a stairway to the deck where our stuff would settle.

Then, we had to drag the stuff across E deck to a teensy, tiny elevator barely large enough to get the corner sections into, which would drop us to G deck. This elevator was part of the ship's original facilities. Since it was prone to failure, we would scramble up the central staircases to return to the dock. No sense in stressing the balky antique "lift". (That's English talk for "elevator".)

The elevator worked ok for loading in, but a few days later, when it was time to load out there was some anxiety among the exhibitors about whether the thing would hold out for the duration. Dropping thousands of pounds of toy trains two decks was one thing. Lifting them all two decks was quite another. Sure enough, it quit. As we were pulling sections of the C+D apart, we heard one of the more laconic members of the club strolling about the deck, calling out, "Iceberg! Dead ahead!" He came up to us and reported, "Great news, folks. The elevator has broken down, and the maintenance people seem about as concerned as the captain of the Titanic."

We had to hoist the layout up two flights of stairs, a little at a time.

Jim's expression three days earlier seems to anticipate the ordeal...

[Guy64]

Jim makes sure all is straight as I close latches and connect wiring underneath. Already, Jim has to take care to avoid bumping his head against the staircase.

Not quite visible in this shot, behind Jim, we found a hole in the carpet, which turned out to be a hole in the deck, about 4" square. Unable to contain our curiosity, we got a flashlight and peered down into the black abyss. What greeted us was the empty, rusty bilge of the ship! Nothing but rusted steel hull, as far as we could see, for another 20 feet down. Kinda creepy, really. :eek:

We put a container over the hole to prevent little feet from being swallowed...

[Guy64]

Besides kid types 1-5, another type, which does not seem to occur independently of the others, is the "follower". This type likes to follow the train as it rumbles nonstop around the entire layout, oblivious to any obstacles in the real world. Here two followers have lost interest in Bossy, and are bearing down on a gate operator. Did they stop before colliding with the unsuspecting gateman? I don't remember. Sometimes the SIT (Stop In Time) success rate for followers is much lower than for 1/64 engineers stopping for Bossy. Not sure why.

[Guy64]

The whole layout, as of August 2000. Looks kinda small from this angle. It seems much bigger when setting it up, or taking it down.

[Greg Elems]

Chuck,

Glad to see these pictures posted. They are worth seeing again and the new ones add to the story.

Thanks,
Greg

[CBCNSfan]

Hi Chuck, nothing since the 29th, Two questions Do you have anymore to post? If Not
Can you get some more to post? The scenery is great but the children's faces are priceless. I really enjoyed the photo's and the narritive that you posted with them.
MORE PLEASE

Cheers Willis

[Guy64]

Hi, Willis...

The encouragement is appreciated. Many thanx!

I think I've exhausted the "A" list pix that I currently have for the mod layout. Next week will be a heavy work week for me, so the immediate future will see little posting from these parts.

I do have a hankerin' to set up a few sections of the mod layout in the garage for pixelating scenes and equipment portraits, but it's not clear when I'll be able to get to that. The C+D Mountain Division (Christmas layout) needs reposting anyway. I should probly do that next, seeing that the holidays approacheth... :eek:

Fortunately, the Christmas layout is still up from 2003. I don't think I'd have time to set it up otherwise. :rolleyes:

[Lady_Railfan]

Ah! The Christmas layout!! Now THAT'S something to look forward to. :) For those who haven't seen it, I can promise that you're in for a special treat. We'll try to be patient, Chuck.
*signed* Your Devoted Fan :D

[CBCNSfan]

Gee like waiting for Santa Claus :D
Cheers Willis

[Guy64]

It's been awhile since the request was made, but here are a couple shots taken during a "corner test", showing the end construction of C+D module sections (without track or wiring), and how they go together...

[Guy64]

The corner test checking for 90 degree alignment of all six corners, with the minimum of two straight sections. The corners were then shuffled, and the test was made again. The result: Outside corners are interchangeable, indicating that adequate "squareness" of each corner had been achieved! :)

[Nibbler]

Hello chuck, how wide and long are each table, maybe i could do something like that for my trains i hope it looks neet
thanks
alex

[Guy64]

Hello, Alex...

The straight sections are basically 2 feet wide and 4 feet long, with provisions for adding additional space to the front and rear edges. Corners are based on a 3 foot square with the outer and inner apexes removed. These dimensions don't count the 3/4 inch tongue that extends from each male end.

[CBCNSfan]

Hi Chuck, I really like your idea on joining the modules together, excellent! When I think of all the jiggling to get the club modules fitted properly and secured with bolts, just how many problems a system like yours would have prevented. I don't know but to me it looks like your system would fit together perfectly every time with little effort, stay tight together without movement. Nice post, the system could be used in any scale.
Cheers Willis

[Guy64]

Hi Willis!

You're right, the system is not gauge exclusive. It is also adaptable to more sophisticated scenery techniques, something we will be exploring as the hirail area of the layout expands.

When designing the system, it was my hope to eliminate some of the steps needed for assembly. For several years, I observed modular groups like the Tinplate Trackers and others setting up, tearing down, packing, unpacking, etc. There's a lot of work to do in limited time, and I knew if Di and I were going to have a layout of any size that we could wrangle on our own (should the need arise), the procedure would need to be much more streamlined than what any existing modular system required.

After much thought, not to mention prayer and fasting (I'm half kidding, eating continued), it became obvious that by discarding certain assumptions, giving up certain unneeded aspects of versatility, and eliminating certain redundancies, I could think farther "outside the box" when devising our own standards.

Some of the time and space consuming things eliminated were:

Bridge track sections.
C clamps.
Redundant legs at each joint.
Adjustable feet.
The need to manually align each section to its mate.
The need for complex construction techniques (assumed to be necessary for self-aligning modules).

Currently, the legs screw into metal mounting plates under each section. That will remain so for the six corner sections, but I intend to refit the straight sections with folding legs. That will further reduce set-up time, and reduce the number of loose pieces. There are only eight straight sections so far, so the time saved with folding legs will become more of a factor as the system grows.

So far, it's worked very well. Other than folding legs, no significant changes have been needed. All that remains to be designed are racks to make the system easier to transport. That's something I hope to do this Summer.

After that, all we need is a place to set up, and a truck! ;)

[Guy64]

Well, TTOS Convention 2006 has come and gone.

Whew!

It was tons of fun, but as usual, there was little time or light to get proper photos. Snaps will hafta do. They'll be posted gradually as they're editied

Meantime, this has been the scene inside our garage for the last few months...

[Lady_Railfan]

Yay! He's back! Long time no see. :)
TTOS = Tinplate Trackers?
Looking forward to seeing your snaps when you have time.

[Greg Elems]

Chuck, welcome back. Claudia, TTOS is Toy Train Operating Society. Some divisions do more of that than others. Good group of people and they have a snazzy monthly magazine.

Greg Elems

[Guy64]

Thanks Greg and Claudia. It's good to be "back", tho I hadn't left. I was just busy.:D

VERY busy.

Originally scheduled for 2007, the Costa Mesa convention was moved up to 2006 because of "difficulties" with the Eastern division that had been scheduled to host it this year. We've been in "panic-rush mode" for months getting the layout ready for its first display since the 2000 convention aboard the Queen Mary.

There was lots to do. I think we got about 25% of it done. Racks have been built to carry the layout sections and their "add-ons", and all Gargraves track has been ballasted, as seen below.

"Concrete" areas were redone, and dirt scenery was applied. Various minor but crucial repairs were made. Actually, the whole thing worked better than I expected after six years of storage.

We didn't get to such things as lighting the city and farm, installing crossing signals, making legs foldable, and a dozen other things we wanted to do.

Hopefully, we will be able to display it again soon. At least before another six years go by.

[Guy64]

Running at last!

We had a double wreck early on (more about that later), but by late Friday everything was running smoothly. I got a few pix of the wreck, but once the convention was in full swing, opportunities to take more studied shots were very infrequent.

This (Sunday) view of the "long" side of the system illustrates the odd lighting in the parking garage. I had to use the flash. The flash doesn't quite fill the frame, allowing the strange orange glow of the available light to tinge the background...

[Guy64]

The city was laid out a bit differently from the 2000 convention. The C+D headquarters towers were placed where the 1960 Kenner building had been (didn't have tiime to rebuild that one), and Jim Radke's May Company department store (kitbashed from several Plasticville hospitals) was placed in the horseshoe...

[Greg Elems]

Chuck, good to see the new version of the layout. Looking good as usual and quite a plug for S scale I may add. Keep those pictures coming. :D

Greg

[Guy64]

Thanks Greg.

Another view of the city, which is beginning to look like a "blue metropolis". Gotta get more of the old Kenner buildings up again...

[Guy64]

From the "South" side...

Jim's fire station appears at lower left, and things look busier than 2000.

[Guy64]

A closer look at Jim's kitbashed plasticville fire station (right) and his Irwin-era G+P building...

[Greg Elems]

Keep them coming Chuck. Sure enjoy seeing the layout.

Greg

[Guy64]

Will do, Greg! :D

One good thing about being able to post these pix is, it gives me a way to almost rerun the whole experience. It's a little frustrating how the time at these conventions goes by so fast. You just get settled in, get everything working, and it's time to break it all down and pack up! :(

Sure would be nice to have another 3 month mall run like we had in '98.

Jim's Mobilgas was busier than 2000, and sported a few added details. Note Jim's take on current gas prices in the close-up...

[Guy64]

Weddings continued as well. This year, thanks to Di, there were people, even!

[CBCNSfan]

Well summers winding down, the outside work is winding down now I'll get a little modeling done. Fantastic displays Chuck! Yep bet you knew it was coming :D
In the pic. Jim's Mobile Gas on the left bottom there is a weird vehicle with what looks like a little green creature on the sidewalk, want to explain :confused:

Cheers Willis

[Lady_Railfan]

Well, silly. That's the "little purple people eater" of course
:D :D :D

(Apologies to Chuck --- it's been a rough day. :D )

[CBCNSfan]

LOL must be my old age, now I remember the one eyed three toed guy that could fly :D

Cheers Willis

[Guy64]

In the pic. Jim's Mobile Gas on the left bottom there is a weird vehicle with what looks like a little green creature on the sidewalk, want to explain :confused:

Cheers Willis

That's a Matchbox street sweeper. The green thing is one of its rotary brooms. The piece has been available in more realistic colors, but it's a bit small for S. I think Jim put it there for just the type of reaction you gave, Willis!


An overall of the "short" side...

[CBCNSfan]

I think Jim put it there for just the type of reaction you gave, Willis!
Hmmm! a gotcha! and it got me :D
Thanks Chuck

Still enjoying! Willis

[Greg Elems]

Other than the cab being small, there are small sweepers sold. A cement company in Reno used one to clean the side walks and parking lot for its office employees. It was a much dirtier machine though. :D

Greg

[Guy64]

As mentioned earlier, our outing was not without incidents. Early on the first official day of running (Friday) we had a double wreck. This was not staged.

I had just gotten two trains running; a long freight on the outer main pulled by an AM Trainmaster, and a passenger excursion heading the opposite way on the inner main pulled by a SHS SW1. Both had been running for a few minutes when a visitor had asked me a question about something or other, diverting my attention. The area was pretty noisy, but I had just noticed some irregular noises coming from behind me when another visitor shouted "Hey! You got a big wreck happenning!!!" I turned to see the Trainmaster pushing some freightcars into a classic "accordion" formation. Apparently, a coupler malfunction split the freight consist, setting up a tail-ender right in the midst of the industrial area. The passenger train arrived just in time to collide with the wad of freight rolling stock. Fortunately, an older AM 40-footer that has no excessive detail took the impact with the SW1, but also involved were a brand-new Des Plaines bathtub gon, an SHS ore hopper, and some other detailed pieces.

A helicopter news team just happened to be in the area, ready to "hose down" the whole fracas. The next few pix tell the story...

[Guy64]

It didn't take long for the news chopper to begin circling. They got several angles on the pile-up...

[Greg Elems]

I don't see a caboose. Were you runnig with a FRED? :D

Greg

[jbaakko]

"what you don't see is a Caboose on the floor"

Nice wreck...

[Guy64]

Were you runnig with a FRED? :D
Yup. It's on the Railbox boxcar on the pavement near the green truck. Still flashing when I picked up the car. Lotta good it did, huh? :rolleyes: But, better than having a crew tossed around the inside of a caboose. I s'pose.

That news chopper crew was really fascinated by the scene, apparently...

[Guy64]

Our brand-new-just-outta-the-box Santa Ana and Newport Railway boxcar (VERY limited edition) got no respect in the incident. Watta way to begin your first day of service; on your side, in a ditch...

[OldGettysk]

Reallylike that boxcar Do they make it in hO scale ? OLDGETTYSK

[Guy64]

Reallylike that boxcar Do they make it in hO scale ? OLDGETTYSK Nope, sorry, just S and O gauge. Also gotta be a TTOS member to get one.

But what's this? After looking over the views of the wreck, something suspicious caught our eye. We checked over some infrared footage from one of the security cams, and came accross the view below.

What's that in the center of the frame?

[Guy64]

After a bit of digital analysis, enhancement, augmentation and miscellaneous tweaking, we were able to come up with a clearer image. We don't know who this individual is, but he does not appear to be the type of character to have wandering around in one's railyard. Maybe it's the claws, or the fangs, but somehow he exudes hostility. It is quite possible he played a role in the derailment, though we can't prove it. He has absconded to the desert. The military has been alerted.

[Guy64]

Enough disaster and mayhem, let's go people watching.

The farm hasn't changed significantly since 2000. It's still the busiest module in the system, thanks to Bossy's antics. Given the arrangement of the layout area this time, the farm was the first thing to come into view once you got past the 3-rail world.

This pair of twins tended to the safety of Bossy while Di (rt,) loaded cattle...

[Guy64]

Yet, some were more impressed with the trains than with Bossy...

[Guy64]

This quiet little guy seemed very concerned about Bossy's safety. He displayed a marked look of relief when Bossy got off the track...

[Lady_Railfan]

Oh, what fun!!! I finally had a chance to visit this thread in depth again, and I urge anyone who hasn't done so to go back to the beginning and spend some quality time enjoying adventures on the C+D! Posts beginning with Bossy's debut (page 4, post #36) are a special joy to behold. (Can you tell I'm a fan?)

[CBCNSfan]

Ahh! Bossy silly me, I was just going to ask what had the young fellows attention. Thanks Claudia, Chuck sorry I was so taken by the picture I forgot to read the post. :o
Thanks again
Willis

[Guy64]

Concern for Bossy was rekindled when another operator took her turn...

[Guy64]

Our quiet man moved on to check on Louie the Loader, who was hidden behind his shack when this pic was taken...

[Guy64]

There was plenty of room around the layout this time out. Since he wasn't slammed up against a 3' square column, Louie the Loader was easy to see, and grabbed much attention...

[Greg Elems]

Chuck,

Great pictures as usual. Seeing the younger generation studying your layout intently bodes well IMHO.

Greg

[Guy64]

Seeing the younger generation studying your layout intently bodes well IMHO.
I hope you're right, Greg.

I've heard the pessimistic view that kids in the age group seen here are naturally fascinated with anything mechanical, but when they get older and their thinking becomes more abstract, they abandon any interest they might have had for trains, being diverted to computers, video games and other contemporary "distractions".

I'm sure it happens, but otoh, there's more to it. When I was a kid (early '60s), PCs and video games were unheard of, but there were still many "distractions" from trains: The Jet Age, the Space Age, TV, the latest Detroit Iron, Rock 'n Roll, etc. As for real trains, they didn't appear any more to the average person than trains do now. Usually they were seen as an obstacle holding up street traffic. I was given a train set at an age that required me to "grow into" the toy. Normally the Christmas season was the one time of year the set saw the light of day. The only reason I kept it all those years was that it is a keepsake, a gift from my grandad. There was no reason to suppose that I would ever become a mrr'er as an adult.

Yet, here am I with all these trains. I can only hope the same thing happens here and there with the current crop of kidlets.

For now anyway, Louie the Loader seems to be reeling them in...

[CBCNSfan]

AH! at last I see Louie :D that must be a fun layout to display.
Keep it coming Chuck
Cheers Willis

[OldGettysk]

great to see those kids around the layout .last week I took my nephew and his son to a model train show. Now my young nephew wants to start a lego train layout .so that just shows there is hope for the future. just need a little puch that's all

[Guy64]

After the thrill of tending Bossy wears thin, most kids move on to the crossing gates. I s'pose gates are easier to relate to than cows.

One of very few shots I took from outside the layout...

[Guy64]

The views from inside where sometimes more interesting anyway. This gate tender is all business. Look at that grip!

[Guy64]

But still, he didn't hesitate to pose for a photo op with Mom and Dad...

[Guy64]

Some kids seemed surprised by the results of pushing a designated button. Real mechanical motion caught them off guard.

"Hey! That really moved!!"

[Guy64]

Most of these kid-on-button shots tell me that maybe, just maybe we need a button that's easier for kids to push, especially a button that must be pushed and held down. This gatekeeper was getting a bit frustrated...

[Guy64]

Most, however, didn't let a stubborn button - or anything else - stop them.

This little girl was intense. She was right on cue. When the train got to the crossing those gates were down, and they didn't go up until the whole train had passed. Her big brother had to wait a while for his turn...

[Guy64]

...and what choice did he have?

"Back off, Bub! I'm workin' here!!"

[Lady_Railfan]

:D I love it!!! (When we go to those shows, The Husband has to drag me away so the little kids can play!) :D

[Guy64]

It took some parental intervention to restore order...

[Guy64]

Finally, big brother got his turn, but he was closely supervised by the outgoing crew...

[Guy64]

Eventually, little sister left big brother alone to develop his own style. Apparently, management wasn't her thing.

We brought a bunch of 0-to-S conversions with us on the last day of the convention. But I forgot to bring a head-end transition car to couple the train of link-coupler cars to the locos we were using, so we couldn't run them. The Marx SP caboose on the tail end of the mixed freight had a link coupler on one end, so I stuck one of Di's favorite cars behind it just to test the current "Thomas the Tank Engine Awareness" factor amongst the kids. Result: Very high. Terence the Tractor was well noticed...

Hey! I know that guy!!

[Guy64]

I got bored with the angles I was getting of this area from inside the layout, so I stood on a chair, held the camera over my head, and...

...another two-hander. Yep, we need a more kid-friendly button...

[Guy64]

Another "follower" practicing his art...

[Greg Elems]

Hey Chuck,
Are you still running the C&D "S"ystem? :D Missed your posts here of late.

Cheers,
Greg

[Guy64]

Yo Greg...

It's nice to be missed. 2006 ended kinda busily, with various family "medical issues" and such.

The C+D "S"ystem has been undergoing minor repairs since it was taken down after the TTOS convention closed last August. It's now stored in its racks, cases, boxes, etc.

Right now I'm trying to decide whether to spend money on new track to replace the Gargraves, or on a new AM U25B. Decisions, decisions...:rolleyes:

[Greg Elems]

Chuck, good to see you here again. Hope things are going better now than the end of 2006 for you. Tough decision - track or an engine. I know you will like the U25B if you get one. AM did a pretty good job on it and mine is a smooth runner.

Cheers,
Greg

[Guy64]

Ahem. Yeah, I know, still no new pix.:rolleyes:

Well, I made up my mind. At least for the time being. Coughed up for a Santa Fe U25B, which arrived yesterday. I decided I would put a bit more wear on the Gargraves track b4 ripping it up for American S Gauge code .172 flex, which I chose over SHS flex. The choice of track was confirmed when I saw the new ASG turnouts at the last TTOS meet. Niiiiiiice!

The C+D System is still in racks, in the garage, with the GG rail corroding as I type. To celebrate 3/16 Day, I'm hoping to set up the layout in the garage and driveway the day after 3/16/07, which falls on a Friday. With the early switch to DST, there will be an extra hour to run trains!:D

The Christmas layout is still up, and I still intend to take pix b4 packing it away for a few months.

C y'all.

[Guy64]

One the occasion of 3/16/07, we had the C+D System set up (partially) in the garage. Seen below is a train of Max 3/16" scale 0 gauge cars (real steel!) winding through the city area behind my AM SD60 and my new AM U25B. either loco alone could handle the consist, but my friend Jim says a train that long doesn't "look right" with only one diesel at the head. So, I put the two DC locos together. I was going to put a few buldings in the area, but Jim claimed to prefer watching the train slither through the "S" curve with no structures to obstruct his view. It did reduce the tear-down time.

[jbaakko]

Hey there, I like that lead locomotive!

[Guy64]

That BNSF SD60 is one of my favorites. I wish it was available in the latest Heritage scheme.:(

Jim is definitely a "steam guy". It didn't take much cajoling to get him to bring his brand-new AM Santa Fe Northern over for its first run...

[Greg Elems]

Hi Chuck,
I must say you came back with a bang. :D That Santa Fe 4-8-4 is a sweet looking steamer. Nice mix of the the two diesels. I do like those AM U25B's.

Greg

[Guy64]

That Santa Fe 4-8-4 is a sweet looking steamer.Greg

Yo! Greg!

That AM Steamer is a wonder to behold. Kinda out of our price range tho, even if it does cost only half of what a brass version would. That's why I never tease Jim about his steam habit. He buys all the expensive steam stuff, and brings it over here to run!:)

How's life on the line been lately?

[Greg Elems]

Hi Chuck,

Is that steamer on scale wheels or AF compatable? For the price I think it's a better deal than the Lionel 4-8-4, just my opinion though.

I've started running on the road, giving the yard a break for a while. This week I'm on vacation and trying to get some loose ends tied up and work on a few modeling projects too. :D

Greg

[Guy64]

Greg...

The version in that shot is hi-rail (AF comp.). We tested it through the only 19" curve on the line, and it did just fine.

I agree about it being a better value than Big L's, tho L did a good job reviving the Gilbert version (if you don't think about the smoke unit). After that run, Jim got the all-black Flyonel Northern as well.

Jim also plans to get the Empire State Express Hudson that AM offers. We are gonna be smokin' :D!

[Greg Elems]

Chuck,

Sounds like Jim has a nice fleet of big steamers. Be sure to post the Empire State Express pictures. That is a sweet looking engine from the pictures I've seen. You should start a steam thread with all those engines you have running. :D I know the layout has to be set and running. :D

Greg

[Guy64]

We just got back from NMRA's "Anaheim Special" National Train Show. Tons of fun, and a buncha work as well. We'd been getting ready for the July event since hearing about it in January. I didn't contact NMRA until April, and was told they were "already full" of layouts. Disappointed, I gave them our name "just in case" somebody had to bow out. I continued work on the layout, bumping along at a moderate pace, using the July 16 NTS load-in date as a target even though we didn't expect to attend.

Sure enough, late in June we get a call asking us to attend. Somebody had to cancel (a big layout apparently) and we were in! As one might imagine, the work pace on the C+D System increased a tad.

For 5 weeks I was flailing away at the thing during every spare minute, completing two new sections, painting roads, installing new connectors, fixing things that got busted at the last show (Aug 2006), making restraining stanchions, etc. etc.

Got about 1/3rd done that I hoped to do, but the system was presentable. Now that the event is history, there are a few dozen pix to edit, some of which will appear here. In the meantime, here's a taste of what went on:

Di resumes loading/unloading cattle, Bossy having just been delivered from the path of a BNSF freight train...

[UP2CSX]

Looking good, Chuck (and Di). I've missed this whole thread since most of the posts were before I came on board. That is a really nice S scale layout you've built. Nice combination of scale and that old American Flyer look. I think I spied a Plasticville fire station in the back of one of those photos. I had one on my AF layout when I was a kid with two of the most horrid looking cast metal fire trucks you've ever seen. I loved that thing. :D

[Guy64]

Thanks, Jim.

I think you mean this building which has been moved from its 2006 position.
It's Jim Radke's kitbash of several Plasticville kits. It got a lot of attention, particularly from an active L.A. City fireman who also wanted to know where Jim got the L.A.F.D. ladder truck in front of the building.

[OldGettysk]

That is one fine looking firehouse !!!

[UP2CSX]

Yeah, that's the one, Chuck. I could only see the side profile so I didn't realize all the work that went into that kitbash. Very impressive work on the fire station and really great work on the apparatus. I even see a Crown pumper sticking out the one door, a very rare bird in any scale. Jim must be a real expert in kitbashing fire trucks. Is he a firefighter himself or just a buff? I loved fire trucks my whole childhood...and then grew up to be a cop. Go figure. :) I still like to look at fire apparatus though but I did learn to run out of burning buildings, not in. :eek:

[Guy64]

The fire station is kitbashed, but the equipment is mostly Code 3 or Ertl. Jim's very good at finding the odd diecast item.


There were many photo ops, unless one considers time. Time to shoot pix. There was very little of that. Ironic, really. Usually we have lighting issues at these events. This time we had (relatively) ample light, but very little time to use a camera.

I did manage to get a shot of "kid #5" (my designation). His expression was typical...

[UP2CSX]

Well, there's some nice fire apparatus available in 1/64 apparently. I haven't seen that nice a hook and ladder in HO. That's a classic photo with the kid. Those 1/64 trains sure attract a lot more attention than our 1/87 trains. :)

[Guy64]

One of the advantages we have in attracting the attention of kids is our table height: 30" at the rail head. Kids tend to gravitate toward what they can see, and many can't see trains that are 48" or more off the floor. We also got several appreciative comments from parents who were glad not to have to hoist up their kids to see the action. Yes, the layout edge is more vulnerable, but how can we get new blood into the hobby if we keep sending "trains-are-for-adults-only" messages?


I'm not sure what this little one was trying to say, but I think it was generally positive...

[UP2CSX]

I agree about the low table height. As long as you have enough members to keep the kids from tearing things up too bad, you'll get a lot more interest.

I think that little girl was hoping she could press those buttons and make the train go faster. :)

[Guy64]

"Whuuuuuuuuuuuuut?"

It seems like an increasing number of kids register profound amazement when they push a button and something really... well, happens. Especially when something moves. I mean, you push a button that's not on a computer keyboard, and what could happen? If somthing did happen, how would you know it? There's no monitor, no LCD screen. There's nothing but this little button, out in the middle of nowhere, all by itself.

So you push this button just out of curiosity, and what happens? Something moves! Something right there. Not an image on a screen, but a real 3-D object!

How cool is THAT?!?

[UP2CSX]

LOL, Chuck, you have a good point. There are all kinds of neat things being done with computer games now but nothing tops being able to press a real button and watch the results before your eyes. As a little kid in Cleveland, Higbees Department Store had a huge train layout set up in the window. They had all the latest Lionel stuf like logs unloading, cows getting into the stock car, and milk cans being put in the reefer. They had buttons set up, kind of like yours, and the line was an hour long just to press that button and dump those logs. Still one of the biggest thrills of my life. :)

[Guy64]

Whenever I hear the name "Higbees" I think of Ralphie and his interview with "Santa", heh.

"You'll shoot your eye out, kid."


Otoh, "May Co." always made me think of clothes. I hated shopping for clothes. Still do.

Our friend Jim Radke has different memories of the place...

[UP2CSX]

Chuck, indeed, Higbee's will live on forever because of "A Christmas Story". The layout reproduced in the movie is a pretty good representation of what I saw when I was Ralphie's age. I often wonderd how much it cost to put that layout together. I hated May Company too - it always meant back to school clothes for me. Those long lost days of going downtown to shop for special occasions. Now it's just a trip to the mall. Too bad for the kids of today.

[Guy64]

The man in the white T-shirt was especially taken with the G+P buildings. I wasn't sure if he was enthralled with the 1960 set with the yellow panels, or the 1970s sets with the blue panels.

One of them rang his bell, that's for sure.

[UP2CSX]

Chuck, if you look close, it looks like the one girl is closely examining your rope while her little sister looks on. :) I've never heard of G+P buildings. Are they S scale kits or something put together by a member?

[Guy64]

Yeah, I noticed those two girls checking out the rope. Dunno why they were so interested in it. Maybe they were thinking of making a jump rope out of it?

The G+P--or "Girder and Panel"--buildings are a construction toy system that was first offered in 1956 or thereabouts. The concept was acquired by Kenner Toys in the late '50s and re-worked a little into the concept as it now is. There are also "Bridge and Turnpike" sets, "Hydro-dynamic" sets (for manipulating water), "Sky Rail" sets (monorails), and "Home and Subdivision" sets (houses). They are all compatible with each other. Basically they are scaled for HO scale use, more or less. The instruction sheets show pictures of buildings with HO trains running through them.

Kenner updated the look of the buildings over time, issuing several very different panel styles. Kenner sold the patents sometime after going hog-wild into the Star Wars action toy gold mine in 1977.

The Girder and Panel idea was offered again in the mid 1990s by Irwin Toys of Canada. Basically the same size as the Kenner sets, the Irwin sets were re-tooled completely, and their columns and beams are not compatible with Kenner columns and beams.

Currently, the line is owned by Bridge Street Toys. The sets have been re-tooled again, and these sets are compatible with the Kenner sets. You can see them on the web at:

http://www.bridgestreettoys.com

(No, I don't get any compensation from Bridge Street)

We have a couple of small Bridge Street sets, like this bank building...

[UP2CSX]

You know, I thought they looked familiar. I'm sure I had a set of the G+P scyscraper kits when I was about 10. It seems to me that they worked with American City blocks, where you could use them for infill between the girders. Or maybe I just jammed them in there. :) Of course, I think I somehow made Lincoln Logs work with them too. I was a real little engineer then. :D

[Guy64]

Stuffed blocks between the girders? Never thought of that one, heh.

Wish I had.


Here's the other side of the 1960 building. The little red building just beyond it is a Bridge Street fire station...

[Guy64]

Bossy the Bovine wasn't the only busy citizen of the C+D System. Billy the Bag Smasher (lower right) also got a constant workout. He was grateful for the shade under the station eaves...

[Guy64]

We may have middle management material here. This little guy was determined to keep Billy working...

[Guy64]

Jim (at left) watches as another gate operator (far right) struggles to give up his post.

"But there's a train coming!!"

[Guy64]

Thought I'd hang out at the car show going on in the MayCo parking lot. The intersection of uncluttered back streets seemed like a good place to shoot some rolling stock.

Unfortunately, we couldn't get the engineers to do photo stops on the 1st day. The necessary slow shutter speeds made the subjects a bit... indistinct.

See if you can tell what models of locomotives are passing...

[Guy64]

Accross the layout from Billy the Bag Smasher is Louie the Loader, another crowd pleaser (bottom right). Well, for the most part.

But it isn't clear whether this gentleman is pleased, incredulous, confused, stunned, or ?

[UP2CSX]

Chuck, more nice pictures. Great show it must have been. I don't know about the trains behind May Company. One looks like a Black Widow SP Trainmaster. The only thing I can tell from the other one is that it looks like some kind of NYC lighting stripe cab unit.

I think the guy with the camera is wondering if the thing on the forklift is really an S scale beer keg. :)

[Guy64]

Thanks, Jim. You're correct about the SP Trainmaster (American Models). The gray loco is a NYC E8, also by AM.

Maybe the guy with the camera did have a keg on his mind. It wouldn't be the first time somebody made a reference to beer while watching Louie. I guess it's the aluminum barrels.


As interesting as Louie is, this kid was distracted by celebs more contemporary.

Once again, upstaged by Terence the tractor...

[UP2CSX]

I didn't even know that Thomas the Tank Engine and pals have invaded S scale yet. Say what you want about how tacky they are to modelers but they sure have revivied an interest in railroads among young people.

[Guy64]

I didn't even know that Thomas the Tank Engine and pals have invaded S scale yet.

I'm not sure of the scale of this particular Terence. He's one of Ertl's earlier renditions of the character, as close to S scale as has been done, I think. He's been touring the C+D System on his own personal designated flatcar (a Marx conversion) since 1993.

[Guy64]

Another celeb was on the job during the show, though he was easy to miss.

A potential street race among some tuner enthusiasts was about to begin on a downtown one-way street. It slowed to more of a... parade, when Sheriff Taylor showed up in his black-and-white '61 Ford.

[Guy64]

Meanwhile, back at the ranch...

We have a dedicated type 2 watching over Bossy's affairs.

Looking out for Bossy is serious work!

[UP2CSX]

LOL, Chuck, those are some great pictures. Looks like you're ready for a great LeMans race there (except for the Sheriff). That kid sure does look like he's concentrating on something. I think he's wondering if Bossy is about to wander on the track. :)

[Guy64]

That kid sure does look like he's concentrating on something.

He had just released the button and the train was beginning to move when that shot was taken. You could be right, he may have been worried that Bossy would jump back into harm's way. No type 5 was he.



Another probable type 2, the little girl at right had a bit of the worry-wart in her. After a tense wait for the freight to stop, she was visibly relieved when it did stop in time, and very pleased when it started moving again after she pushed the button for Bossy to jump aside.

So many things to go wrong...

[Guy64]

Once she got the idea though, she wasn't quick to pass the torch to some green trainee. She had the system down!
Adult intervention was needed to pry her loose from the button.

"I hafta take turns?!?"

[UP2CSX]

Cute pictures, Chuck. There's something about those larger scale trains that really keep kid's attention that you don't see with HO or N scale. Maybe it's that cow you can actually see. :)

[Guy64]

Sometimes Bossy isn't always seen, at least not while she's making her "moo-ve". Often as not, people are startled by the un-cowlike motion she exhibits.

The blurred figure at left in this shot illustrates...

[OldGettysk]

Hey Chuck good so see little ones and there smiles !!!!

[Guy64]

Thanks, Paul. There was a lot of very young kids at the NTS, more than we expected, in fact. It was quite busy at the farm in particular. Diana spent much of her time there, loading/unloading cattle, milk cans, explaining how the cows moved ("No, they aren't magnetic..."), when to press the button for Bossy to move, etc.

This shows the normal amount of activity at the farm end...

[UP2CSX]

Chuck, it looks like people really did like the old farm. I think that's one thing we've lost in smaller scales. All those operating accesories may seem hokey to a scale modeler but they sure do hold people's attention who aren't looking to count rivets on every passing freight car.

[Guy64]

I'm ok with rivet counters, I think there's a place for that. But you're right, it can get out of hand. Our trouble is, we like it all, from lithographed sheet metal to ultra-detailed scale. There were many hyper-detailed layouts at this show, with inspiring scenery and detail. My favorite was an HO scale intermodal yard module that stretched for...oh, must've been at least 40 feet. Another HO club had their main line weaving through a pine forest that made me shiver just looking at it.

As a kid I had American Flyer S gauge (for which I'm glad). Consequently the C+D System began in a "toy train" mode, with lots of AF operating accessories that I never had as a kid, which--I like to point out--Diana prodded me to buy.

But we never intended to confine the system to AF tinplate. (Ironically, none of the locos we ran at the NTS were AF.) Most of the layout is hi-rail, and will be increasingly so as additions are made. Detail levels will increase and sharpen on newer sections, there will be scratch-building, weathering, "aging" and other such "scale" practices. :eek:

How far will we go with it? Well, if a built-in home layout is "never finished", neither is a modular layout!


Fortunately, not all of our operating accessories are on the farm. There were more accessories--some with "visitor buttons"--at other locations, as Di--desperate for a break--reminds the crowd...

[Guy64]

During breaks (for Di and the cows) the farm crowd would thin out, sometimes causing a glut of operators at the other buttons. We did have a restraining rope on this outing, which worked ok. For the most part, people got the idea: "Please don't touch the layout!"

But the attraction of moving trains was sometimes too much. The need to get a closer look at an impending "meet" made the one in the green shirt forget about ropes...

[Greg Elems]

Hi Chuck,

Sure is nice to see you posting these train show shots. The layout is looking good, even if you think you didn't get enough done. :D

Cheers,
Greg

[Guy64]

Thanks, Greg. Even if I didn't get everything planned done before 8/16, the system does look better than it did at past shows. It's bigger, too.:)

Jim got a greater percentage of his plans done than I did of mine. One of his newest buildings is the "High Fly Inn", a kitbash of several Plasticville motels topped with a 1/72 model of a Douglas Skyrocket. (Advertising, y'know.)

I hope to get a better shot of it in the future...

[Guy64]

Since the last show, Jim's Mobilgas got some finishing touches as well. It got electrified!

OTOH, Jim's pricing system was quite prescient. Even though the price of gas has doubled since 2006, Jim's price boards needed no updating...

[Guy64]

An angle on the city, from a 1/64 scale "news chopper" altitude...

[UP2CSX]

LOL, Chuck, I really like that gas station sign. BTW, I would have been that kid in the green shirt. :)

[Guy64]

Another city angle...

The blue skeleton going up in the center of town is the remains of the tall silver building seen in pix from previous shows. It's made from an Irwin G+P set. I had to repair the original building after the 2006 show because it had suffered some damage (which I thought was minor) from that outing. As I tried to inspect the structure, I found many more damaged columns than I thought there were. I had to dismantle the thing completely, being left with fewer than 50% of the columns intact. This is a known tendency of the Irwin sets; the little "fingers" on the tops of the columns are delicate, and the slightly over-sized dovetails of the beams can break them off under even the most careful use. I didn't have enough extras to rebuild the 15 storey tower. Only 5 stories are shown here, but later I did make it to 8 stories, still short of the needed 15.

It was one of my favorite buildings on the system. I'll need to find another set from some other frustrated architect before the tower can be completed. I've Zap-a-Gapped the rebuilt structure so far, hoping that will hold it together.

The post-modern buildings to the left are also Irwin sets that Jim built. He has managed to keep them together with careful applications of ACC here and there.

[OldGettysk]

looks really good Chuck !!!!

[Guy64]

Thanks, Paul!

One more city angle, from the "East" this time...

[Guy64]

I know there haven't been many pix of trains in this part of the thread. That's mainly because I didn't have time to use a tripod, which would be needed for long exposures. Couldn't get much depth of field, as this shot of Di's Santa Fe F7 demonstrates...

[Guy64]

A couple of overall shots to end this installment:

The C+D System, August 19, 2008...

[Guy64]

Oops!

After emptying the camera again, I found a few more pix from the show, taken late on the last day.

Jim's Pennsy K4 (AM) dashing around a corner as seen from the parking gates between two of his buildings...

[UP2CSX]

Nice job, Chuck and Di. That Santa Fe train really shows what stainless steel looked like back in the days when they kept it shined up.

[Guy64]

Jim's Pennsy passenger train at rest...

[Guy64]

The aborted street race from another angle...

[UP2CSX]

LOL, Chuck, it looks like the guy in the bulldozer could make short work of a street race quicker than that CHP unit. :)

[OldTrail]

I have some questions.I looked around but this thread seems slow, so I'll ask away., as most know I am an N scale modeler. BUT I just inhertited a large colection of American Flyer from my Grand father. I think I may be up for a scale change. the questions: Just what scale is this? S ? can the american flyer be re powered for DC control? the AC is to un reliable, I do not really care what it does for the resale, as I do not intent to ever sell this equiptment. I cant understand why the detail on the steam locos is so much more intricate than those plastic ville house and the older timplate house i got. I see, assum,ing this is s scale, theres a reasonable availability of new locos, track, switches, ect? speaking of switches, do make lessor toy looking ones than the OE? now to contradict, talking realistic looking, as hooky as some people find the operating accesories, I find them NEAT! and will buy them as i can. any way, any insight is apprciated.... Ryan

[Guy64]

Ryan...

S Scale is 1/64 (3/16 inch = 1 foot) Some like to think of it as "between O scale and H0 scale". Postwar AF is S gauge, but prewar AF is 0 gauge or standard gauge.

AF and Lionel have been wrapped up in the same bundle since the late '60s, but Lionel now makes new AF S gauge, mostly from postwar AF tooling (though some new tooling has been developed for the AF line). Quite a few postwar accessories have been reissued as well.

Original Gilbert AF locos feature "universal" motors with coil fields which can be reconfigured for DC operation. The simplest way is to remove the E-unit and install a bridge rectifier for using a reverse switch on your DC power supply. A few AF locos had permanent magnet fields for DC-only operation, but they are uncommon.

There are several other companies that make S gauge equipment Such as:

American Models: http://www.americanmodels.com/

S Helper Service: http://www.showcaseline.com/

Des Plains Hobbies: http://www.desplaineshobbies.com/

to name a few.

Most of the locos appearing in this thread are by American Models or S Helper. They do have more intricate detail than AF locos.


Does that give you enough to think about for awhile?:)

[Greg Elems]

AM and SHS both make realistic looking track. AF track can have wooden ties added to help and Gar-Graves makes a more realistic looking track. AM and SHS have the best track IMHO for looks and allowing AF equipment to run on it. SHS sells their cars and engines in sets that are AF compatible or separately with scale sized wheels included. You have to change them out and add your own scale couplers. S scale couplers by Kadee work well and SHS has Kadee compatible couplers of their own.

Greg

[OldTrail]

thanks guys, this gets me started, anyway. I would have to change all the couplers any way, perhaps the wheel sets as well, as there are two different coupler types, one is a knuckle and the other is like a hook. the wheels all have bad flanges ect. these trains were in operation until i packed them up last week. however, my sister allowed her two year old to run rampant on the layout and he managed to break alot of it. thanks again and some pics to follow. Ryan

[Guy64]

It has begun...

The great C+D System mainline upgrade is underway.

First, we must remove the old track, which turns out to be no easy feat! I installed this track with the idea that it should never come off or even shake loose a little from transport mishaps.

Well, mission accomplished! It will be one tedious ordeal removing enough of this stuff to lay down the new roadbed and American S Gauge track. Fortunately, this must be done only once, and not to the six sections that will retain AF track.

That leaves just... nine sections to redo...

Sheesh. This is gonna take longer than I thought.

[UP2CSX]

Man, Chuck, it really looks like you need a jackhammer to get those rails up. Looks like a prototytpe in the pictures but I'm sure you wish you would have used a little less glue and ballast now.

[Guy64]

Actually, the rails came up quite easily. But it seemed proper to take out the spikes first, using a handy-dandy specially modified cheap screwdriver...

[Guy64]

...then the rails were pulled up with pliers.

"All too easy..."

[Guy64]

When the GG track was installed, I found I needed roadbed of 3/16" thickness to align the rail height to AF track. Cork roadbed for H0 was the easiest to find with that spec, but it wasn't wide enough for S, so I laid it with a 1/2" gap between the two halves. The gap was filled with ballast.

I didn't foresee that that gap would make the job of prying up the track significantly easier than it might have been.

Rather than trying to bash into the ballast from the top (as I did with my first try), I attacked from one end of the module where it was possible to penetrate the ballast in the 1/2" gap underneath the ties, then just pry them up!

Not as easy as pulling the rails up, but doable in a reasonable amount of time.

Once again, another "specially modified" old, cheap screwdriver came in handy...

[Guy64]

After clearing away the loose debris, we work sideways, removing the cork roadbed right up to the shoulder...

[riverotter]

Thanks for the tip about using HO cork under S track; I hadn't thought of that angle before...

[Guy64]

After clearing up more debris, some trimming here and there to get a fairly uniform width, and sanding down to the base board, we are left with a nice 1 5/8" wide space between the ballast shoulders, ready for new roadbed...

[Guy64]

...both layers of it...

[Guy64]

...then we put some weighted 2x2s on the cork to set the glue...

[Guy64]

...then on with new American S Gauge track...

[Guy64]

...add some fresh ballast, a smattering of ground foam "weeds", and it's done!

1 down, 8 more to go. The next 4 are curves! :eek:

[Greg Elems]

Chuck,

IMHO the work is worth it. Nice job, I think you will be glad in the end when you are finished.

Greg

[UP2CSX]

Excellent work, Chuck. Makes me wish I had the space for S scale. You can really do some nice detailing in the larger scales.

[Guy64]

Thanks for the kind words, folks!

Work continues...

The 1st corner is completed except for ballast. I've decided to lay all the new track and test it for operation from now on b4 applying ballast and other finishing touches.

The change to solid rail from the hollow Gargraves rail is more noticeable than it was with the 1st (May Co) section of ASG track. That section was newly built during the rush to get ready for the NTS. By changing a section from hollow-rail GG to solid-rail ASG, the full contrast between the two is more evident. The whole feel of the section is different; more model-railroady.

I like it.:)